Immigration Situation

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Immigration Situation

Post by Lightning Rod » March 28th, 2006, 12:36 pm

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John and Yoko showing immigration card

Immigration Situation
for release 03-28-06
Washington D.C.


Let's consider the Roman Empire. When Rome conquered a nation or a tribe, part of the booty was slaves. They marched them back to Rome in legions. Captured slaves were to Rome much like illegal immigrants are to America. They did the shit work that the Roman citizens didn't want to do. You know, they stomped the grapes and tended the fields and the children and emptied the chamber pots. It was cheap labor. Slaves were part of the wealth of conquest and empire.

Every empire in human history has been based on two things, military might and slave labor. The American Empire is no different. Only our slaves come voluntarily, not at the point of a sword. (Or perhaps it's an economic sword.) These people are not the Mongol Horde, they are just looking for work and a better life.

Here is where the problem arises: If you are a businessman and you want cheap labor, you are more than happy to see an illegal alien who is willing to work for peanuts and is not likely to quibble about unions and benefits and working conditions lest he come to the attention of " La Immigracion."

On the other hand, if you are a working-class Joe who is competing for a job with Jose' from South of the border, the picture looks a little different. It looks like the price of your major resource, your labor, is being driven down in the marketplace by the presence of illegal immigrants.

This is the pimple on the butt of our border policies and it is about to come to a head. We had the largest demonstrations on the streets of our major cities this weekend since the Vietnam War protests and the civil rights marches. A pimple forms when a foreign object gets imbedded in the sebaceous oil that oozes from the pores of our skin. In this case the illegal workers are the oil (cheap labor), but they are also the foreign objects.

I've pondered this subject long and long as I have watched the sustained, growing public outcry to 'fix the border problem.'

There are several ways to deal with the immigration situation:

The Draconian Approach: (aka the Sensenbrenner plan, HR 4437)

The plan goes something like this. Build a wall around the whole fucking country and deport the 12 million illegals that are already here and let the retirees in Arizona and Florida mow their own damned lawns. Fine or jail any employer that knowingly or unknowingly hires an illegal. I'm sure that we could stop most, if not all illegal immigration. It would be relatively simple. We just deploy sharpshooters and armed unmanned drone aircraft to cover every inch of the border and summarily execute every alien or jack-rabbit or armadillo who dares to breach the boundary. And we leave their bodies to stink in the sun and be eaten by buzzards and coyotes. It would take about two weeks for the word to spread. The Poet's Eye can see it now, we open dude ranches where gun-happy rich white guys like Cheney and Sensenbrenner can go for a week-end and bag a few illegals. It would make the Iron Curtain look like a theme park.

The Good Samaritan Approach:

Institute an expanded guest-worker program with a path to citizenship. This is one of the few policy positions that George Bush maintains that I could actually support. But it neatly dove-tails into the next approach.

The Business As Usual Approach:

Claim that we already have the necessary laws on the books, all we have to do is enforce them. Then you continue not to enforce them. That way you can pay lip-service to border enforcement while still enjoying the benefits of a cheap, plentiful, compliant labor pool. I predict that this will be the outcome of the current political brouhaha.

The Open Border Approach:

Do Away with the US-Mexican border and the Canada-US border. Grant amnesty and citizenship to all current illegal residents and open the doors to whomever wants to come and live and work and pay taxes in this country. Hey, I love Mexican food. I'm happy to see the Latino culture flourish inside our borders.

Jobs and people can migrate in any direction. Rather than endure the cost of living around Washington D.C., I could rent a villa in San Jose' and sit in the plaza with a wireless laptop and do my work from there. Plus I could probably hire a cook, a housekeeper and a yard-man. I'm not sure if I would be hiring Mexicans who would then have no need to migrate North or maybe I would hire unemployed American manufacturing workers who have waded across the Rio Grande in search of their vanished jobs.

If this globalization thing is really going to work, we have to walk the walk as well as simply talking the talk. What would this mean? It would mean opening all borders. It would mean establishing a world-wide standard currency which would provide the basis for a universal minimum wage. No more tariffs or sanctions or other trade barriers. Let the free market rule. This would mean that Bolivian cocaine, Afghani heroin and Mexican or Canadian pot would be available over the counter. And aluminum tubes suitable for enriching uranium? How many do you want? We'll throw in some yellow-cake as a bonus.

No, if we are going to do globalization, let's do it right. We could import our prostitutes from Holland and Thailand and market corn-fed midwest girls to sultans in Dubai or Bahrain. We could outsource our abortions to Brazil; gay marriages could be performed in Denmark or Sweden. We could export sin and import Salvation. The Christians will love it.

There are four major factors in our new global economy. There are resources, there is technology, there is capital and there is labor. The first three are owned or controlled by about 10% of the world's population. The only way the rest of us have to participate in the global economy is by selling the only thing we own--our labor. The only way to insure the value of that resource, is for workers to organize on a global basis. I hate to sound like a Marxist, I know it's so passe, but "Workers of the World, Unite!"



Keep you doped with religion and sex and TV,
And you think you're so clever and classless and free,
But you're still fucking peasents as far as I can see,
A working class hero is something to be,
A working class hero is something to be.
--John Lennon


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Post by judih » March 28th, 2006, 12:54 pm

i like the san jose scene!
(i'm spoiled, l-rod - i can only hear your Eye done in your own voice - i've been rodcast)

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Post by Doreen Peri » March 28th, 2006, 12:56 pm

They could always make it illegal for all immigrants to be in the United States as well as all descendants of all immigrants which would cause a mass exodus, thereby giving the land back to the American Indians who it was stolen from to begin with.

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Post by Dave The Dov » March 28th, 2006, 2:53 pm

How can a land of immigrants put rules on new immigrants???? Sensenbrenner or as I like to call him Senselessbrenner is from my home state. The only policy he knows is putting his head where the sun don't shine. Oh yeah in a way he's picking up where McCarthy left off.
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Post by abstroint » March 28th, 2006, 6:34 pm

I do like this open border thing but instead of Denmark or Sweden, because they're too cold, I'm going to South Africa to get married.

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Post by Jenni Mansfield Peal » March 28th, 2006, 9:17 pm

Right arm, LR

In spite of the rigors of the NAFTA Highway in my back yard, I have always thought that anything that we could do to help boost Mexico's economy would have to be good. In all of this debate, I don't hear anybody talking about why Mexicans are so desparate to leave their own country, and what we can do to help.

One other thought: living as I do in an old south city, and being as I am descended from a DAR/UDC old southern family, I have been very interested in how the old black/white race conflict has been going. It seems to me that tribal conflicts can hang around forever (look at, well, just about anywhere in the old world.) But a miracle is happening down south. It seems that, at least here in Dallas, there has been a large enough influx of people who just don't care about our old south history and racism that the old conflict has lost its edge. It's not hip, not happenin'. Not just Mexican immigrants have given us this tremendous gift, but Asians, Midddle Easterners, and Africans too. I've never heard anybody talk about this before.

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Post by stilltrucking » March 29th, 2006, 12:36 am

Good Eye Clay, I kind of like the name Doctors Without Borders. I am first generation born here. My family was the tired, poor,
huddled masses, wretched refuse homeless, tempest-tost
I try to keep the big picture in mind
Image

Borders? I don’t see no lines on that picture, I love the word reify

Personally I agree with Mel Brooks in the 2000 year old man.
INTERVIEWER: Do you remember the national anthem of your cave?
THE 2000-YEAR-OLD MAN: I certainly do. I'll never forget it. You don't forget a national anthem in a minute.
INTERVIEWER: Let me hear it, sir.
THE 2000-YEAR-OLD MAN (sings): Let 'em all go to hell ... except cave seventy-six!
.
I'm going to South Africa to get married
:shock:

You mean to say that you have been living in sin. I thought you were a married woman.

I only wish I could be there to dance at your wedding. :)

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Post by firsty » March 29th, 2006, 1:31 pm

if it's a plan that involves more drugs and more hookers, it's impossible for me to not get behind it. i'll have the monkeys start working up some marching signs.
and knowing i'm so eager to fight cant make letting me in any easier.

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Post by abcrystcats » March 30th, 2006, 1:31 am

I don't know what you're actually advocating, LRod, but if you are advocating opening all borders, that's fine because you're in such a small minority of Americans right now, that it's funny.

Go for it. Your crowd is small. It only looks big from your angle.

Your first two ideas have the most supporters. Beyond that, your prospects are bleak.

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Post by firsty » March 30th, 2006, 12:25 pm

sometimes, when something looks big, it aint because of the wide angle lens.

the global economy is driving changes, and the human soul in place and time is merely another commodity, so it's only a matter of capitalist "progress" that will determine the end of all borders anyway. immigration is only a problem until you can get the same house anywhere. once that happens, who cares? at least by then we'll have cloning to provide us with a stable of low-wage workers.
and knowing i'm so eager to fight cant make letting me in any easier.

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Post by abstroint » March 30th, 2006, 3:17 pm

Hey J

I wish you could dance at my wedding too.

Ever wonder if it would be better if you didn’t post at all? I do almost ever time I post.

Yes, I am married. So, why South Africa? Well, the thread was rather jovial, sort of like a party. I didn’t want to trash the party so I protested in a hushed tone. Ya see I noticed that the subject matter and the actual words weren’t matching up. Wide open borders but the gays and lesbians are still being asked to hide themselves in Sweden or Denmark. I decided rather than cause a scene I’d just rebel quietly. I get to release some stress without tipping over tables.

Fuck the whole god damn thing. It won’t work with the borders completely open or completely closed. If any group of people is asked to go off into hiding so another group can be happy than not only are the borders truly not open but there will be violence accompanying their implied opening. If everyone isn’t allowed to move about freely there will still be problems. People of all religions, sexes, races, sexuality….the whole range will have to be willing to be in the same space with one another or the fighting continues.

Really I don’t think it would be all that different open or closed.

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Post by stilltrucking » March 30th, 2006, 7:45 pm

Ever wonder if it would be better if you didn’t post at all? I do almost ever time I post.
I feel the same way. I still can not forget that well formated poem of yours "shut the fuck up" i been trying to read it but it twists my eyes 8) I have printed it out and I am going to break it down line by line. I am constantly deleting posts before any onc can reply, i have stopped deleting posts that have been replied to

but if the X delete button is still available in the upper right hand corner I feel entitled to use it. I am happy to see ya. posting. I miss those shopping trips you used to do under that other user name on litkicks. I was stunned, was astonished all I could say is That woman can shop. For years I would go into a Walmart and try to put myself into your mind set. :D

It seems that, at least here in Dallas, there has been a large enough influx of people who just don't care about our old south history and racism that the old conflict has lost its edge. It's not hip, not happenin'.
I think native Texans have never liked to think of themselves as southerners. THe ones I have trucked with have considered themselves Westerners. I bet most of them can not name all six flags over Texas. They can usualy get five but they always skip the confedrate flag. Just an observation of mine, Cecil or Clay would know better.
I don't hear anybody talking about why Mexicans are so desparate to leave their own country, and what we can do to help.



I think the Chinese imports are hitting them worst than even here.

Clay about the Culture flourishing here? The Mexican culture was here before us,

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Post by stilltrucking » March 30th, 2006, 8:35 pm

Cindy I should not be posting about this either, I missed your levity. I got no problem down here 150 miles from the border
I do not feel threatened by illegals. My uncle Phil from Philedelphia had to sneak into this country to escape Poland in the l1939, Have you ever heard of a ship called the USS Saint Louis?
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The truth is I spend more time thinking about Christian Zionism, and the war in Iraq. I think those wacko protestant preachers are a threat to every one, not just the gay and lesbian community. I think they are a worse threat than any wet back.

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Post by abstroint » March 31st, 2006, 2:57 pm

Really I don’t think it would be all that different open or closed at this time because of statements like this:
We could import our prostitutes from Holland and Thailand and market corn-fed midwest girls to sultans in Dubai or Bahrain.
Are you kidding? The way I understand it women from other countries are trafficked here with the promise of getting to the US and the potential of the American dream coming true for them…they end up as slaves in the US hooking for their lives.

Women as commodities is exactly the sort of fucking thought process that keeps me from thinking now is a good time to open borders. There are other reasons but white male dominance is so imbedded in people’s minds that often people, to include women, don’t even see that they advocate what they say they’re against. Advocating anything seems to be all about material gain with no thought to any conscience that doesn’t directly affect their own wealth. Even those without power are thinking about this issue with the perspective of what they have to gain from it. The power struggle remains, as long as that is the case, I can’t see the benefit of shared resources, more whores doesn’t benefit me, fuck the borders opening.
if it's a plan that involves more drugs and more hookers, it's impossible for me to not get behind it. i'll have the monkeys start working up some marching signs.
More drugs? Maybe. More hookers? I’m doubtful. It’s likely there’d be less women coming to whore themselves if they’re not forced to do so, to pay the debt of their having to come here secretly. If I were to make arguments to support open borders, less forced prostitution would be one of them, but sounds like that would ruin it for those that have the attitude that makes it impossible for me to see the possibility of it working.

Side note: It is difficult to joke about such serious issues and actually pull off funny. It is far more common for these sorts of jokes to come of as ignorance.
sometimes, when something looks big, it aint because of the wide angle lens.

the global economy is driving changes, and the human soul in place and time is merely another commodity, so it's only a matter of capitalist "progress" that will determine the end of all borders anyway. immigration is only a problem until you can get the same house anywhere. once that happens, who cares? at least by then we'll have cloning to provide us with a stable of low-wage workers.
This makes more sense…and NAFTA among other things will open the borders eventually…but over all you impress me as nothing more than a squealing “capitalist” pig…human souls are not commodities, neither are our resources…capitalism is the reason you think people and resources are nothing more than commodities…resources are a necessity that has been taken for granted for too long.

Still- I didn’t have time to finish reading your link. I will.

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Post by stilltrucking » March 31st, 2006, 3:37 pm

It is far more common for these sorts of jokes to come of as ignorance.
I just don't know about that, maybe a guy thing

nothing funny about immigration issue is that I think it is a sham, Oh yeah what was that bit about Neil Bush in Thailand, and certain credit card receipts.

Oh well cindy, you know Clay and Eye and I dont always agree I still enjoy that sick bastard's sense of humor, it helps me maintain. Meanwhile Millions of americans are going to Iraq it is a feild day for corporate america,

am I young enough for a revolution?
mean while future generations may look like picasso's unless we stop shitting in our own nests

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