Dead Sea & Kibbutz Ein Gedi

[judih]

Kibbutz Ein Gedi is 50 years old this year.
Kibbutz Nir Oz is 50 years old this year, but that's about the only similarity between our two forms of celebration.

Kibbutz Ein Gedi shows the fruit of talented, intelligent planning. It is a lush place filled with talented people, and we were invited to its special nostalgic evening for a play that the dramatic members of the kibbutz put together 35 years ago. They linked together children's rhymes and songs, created props and scenery, rehearsed and gathered musicians from all over the country. The premiere performance back in 1971 led to about 40 more performances all over Israel.

The actors would go to work at 3 a.m., finish at 10 and then load up trucks to head off to an evening performance. On the way, they'd round up the musicians who lived on various other kibbutzim. My life partner Gad was one of them, playing the flute in his wild improvisational style, even though the notes were firmly written on the page. His friend Micha, drummer and percussionist, joined him in the more wild side of things and after the show ended, and after Gad came back from several years in the U.S., the two of them formed the Jazz Union, a free jazz band.

All that as way of explanation why we were there at last night's event - for Gad to play and for us to be reunited with Micha and his wife.

The players rehearsed. Zo and i walked around the kibbutz photographing cactus and views of the Dead Sea.

We had dinner and then gathered at 9 for the evening's festivities. The intros were made, the musicians played the Overture of the musical, and then the real stuff happened. Micha and Gad brought on some percussion instruments, drums and the flute and improvised. Our kids were thrilled (this was the first exposure they had of how Gad used to make his living from his improvisational jazz style).

The event moved along with a screening of a newly edited movie of the original play. And then it was coffee and nostalgia. A woman came up and introduced herself to us - a relative of Gad's and one he's never met. His family name belongs to one family only in this country, and there was one of them at the performance.

About the kibbutz, itself:
Kibbutz Ein Gedi kisses the Dead Sea, the lowest spot on the planet. It's a remarkable piece of scenery. Here are a few shots:
Looking towards the hills of Sodom (or Sdom)
I.


II.


The Dead Sea


A camel just east of Be'er Sheva


And for those who know the story of Masada, here's a shot of the place taken from the road. You can faintly see the 'snake footpath' that winds up to the summit.



link back to my flickr page: http://www.flickr.com/photos/judih/

[whimsicaldeb]

Your picture of the Dead Sea really shows how much the Dead Sea has shrunken; the damage that has been happening ... and is still happening.

Judih, I’m wondering, during the celebration, was – or did anyone speak of – Ariella Gotlieb (a biologist with Israel's parks authority who works at the Ein Gedi Nature Reserve - see article excerpt below) or the ongoing concerns and work of FoEME as they face the decline of the Dead Sea?

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.c ... CS1NO1.DTL
The Dead Sea really is dying -- starved for water
Upstream, the River Jordan is being dammed, diverted by Israel, Jordan, Lebanon, Syria
John Ward Anderson, Washington Post
Sunday, May 22, 2005

… Today, virtually every major spring and tributary that once flowed into the Jordan has been dammed or diverted for drinking water and crop irrigation by Israel, Jordan, Lebanon and Syria. The Jordan now delivers less than 100 million cubic meters of water a year to the Dead Sea, and as much as half of that is raw sewage, according to Bromberg and other environmentalists.

Months go by in the summer when parts of the river are dry. At Jesus's baptismal site, five miles north of where the Jordan trickles into the Dead Sea, pilgrims fill souvenir bottles with greenish-brown water.

"The irony is that today the Jordan is being kept alive by sewage," Bromberg said.

As the level of the Dead Sea falls, it affects everything around it. Underground pools of fresh water are retreating, pulling water away from plants in major wildlife areas bordering the Dead Sea. The fresh water is hitting pockets of salt deep underground and dissolving it, causing the earth above to collapse into giant sinkholes, which recently forced the closure of an army camp and a trailer park. As the shoreline shifts, rain runoff digs deep gorges in the newly exposed landscape and wipes out roads and any other infrastructure in its path.

"The real solution is that we need to be smarter and use our water in a wiser way," said Ariella Gotlieb, a biologist with Israel's parks authority who works at the Ein Gedi Nature Reserve, an oasis of dense tropical plants, hyenas, ibex, wolves and more than 200 species of birds. The reserve is one of several plant and wildlife sanctuaries threatened by changes in the local ecosystem.

Gotlieb and others said the traditional Zionist dream to "make the desert bloom" has to be updated to reflect the scarcity of resources in a more densely populated country. She pointed to the reserve's neighbor, Kibbutz Ein Gedi, and said it was no longer appropriate for residents there to use natural spring water to tend fruit groves and a botanical garden with more than 800 species of exotic plants in the middle of the desert. Of the 3 million cubic meters of water that flow from Ein Gedi's four springs, not a drop reaches the Dead Sea anymore, she said.

"The Dead Sea is receding because the Jordan River is dead -- it has no relation to the botanical gardens," responded Meir Ron, a founder of the 550-resident kibbutz. He said the problem was a classic battle between man and nature.

"When I was born in Haifa in 1935, there were 600,000 people in Israel, and now there are more than 6 million," he said. "What can we do?”

From Masada, the mountaintop citadel that was fortified by Herod the Great and became a Jewish cultural icon and a symbol of the struggles of modern Israel, the view is of mud flats stretching for miles into Jordan.

"Herod built Masada overlooking the Dead Sea, but he'd turn in his grave if he could see what we've done to it," said Bromberg, the Friends of the Earth environmentalist. "You don't have to be Jesus to walk across the Dead Sea anymore.”

…

Did you hear anyone addressing these issues and if so what was the overall feeling? Was it one of avoidance of the subject matter, or denial that there even is a problem - or a ready willingness to tackle the problems?

Just wondering …

In the US, concerning environmental issues, overall I’d say most people are aware/have some level of awareness – and while most will recycle and such – if it’s not made easy to do, they don’t/won’t do too much until it is made easy.

Education and consistency is key and helpful. Yet even amid Northern Californians (some of the most eco-conscious people around) there are still those folks (usually older folds) who strongly hold onto the denial of any of the facts any one would attempt to get them to see. They remind me of those three monkeys... see no evil, hear no evil, speak no evil.

[stilltrucking]

Yes I know the story of Masada.

++++++++++++++++++++++++

Hi, Still.
i didn't see your comment till just now. The story of Masada is a nice bit of history, but i wouldn't have wanted to be there.

judih
(using the editing facility since this is my eyewitness - hope you don't mind)

[judih]

hi deb,
During the celebration, we were with the performers, not the kibbutzniks. So, we didn't get the chance to sit down and really talk about where we were and what was happening to the Dead Sea.

That would be an amazing session and a real educator for those of us at this end of the Negev where water is now supplied from de-salination of sea water.

Instead, we were involved in discussing another form of conservation - that of historical film shot of kibbutz as it once was. There is incredible history in the archives of many kibbutzim all over the country. The original members of the kibbutzim, whether from pre-WWII Europe or North America, brought with them talent and dedication to culture and education.

When a holiday came around, the level of musicianship, dance and decor was truly something else. Gad remembers his own Kibbutz and the choral singing, the choreography.
There was an ideology of creating true to model socialism - with labour being paramount to basic existence, together with the incorporation of fairness, and hope for cooperation with one another and our neighbours.

In the article you posted, the number 600,000 citizens was mentioned at a time in the past. 600,000 and a very small percentage of them were living in kibbutzim. The filmed history of those special people exist, but the archives are being ignored. The archives of Ein Gedi, for example, have been flooded 3 times.

So, there were discussions of wild searches for footage. Finally finding a small copy of a film without sound (one person commented that 'without sound? You were lucky. I found one without picture!)

There were adventures all over the country, interviewing people. One searcher recalled finding a person who knew a person and then suddenly 3 voices would add footnotes to that particular person (the wife of...the daughter of....)who led to a snippet of film in a forgotten box.

Conservation of history.
And then someone paraphrased Achad Ha'am, a famous historian, who said: "You have to truly honour your present in order to recognize your past. Only then will you be free to head into the future."

i liked that.

Thanks for commenting.
That photo of the Dead Sea is representative of only that one spot. I liked it cause it looked so 'dead'. There are a few different seascapes visible. At one point, the Sea looks like a Sea (well, a large lake is actually what it is). At another point, it is subdivided into pools for the Potassium industry. At another place, it looks like you could walk across it to Jordan.

It's shrinking alright. But it's definitely worth the visit, if ever you're in the area! The trip there is extraordinary. And next time, perhaps the topic of ecology and environment will be breakfast fare, instead of the transient nature of trying to re-capture the cultural history.

[whimsicaldeb]

I had a dream one night …

There was beautiful area, wild, natural, pristine – peaceful and undisturbed full of life and flowers, I and another were enjoying that this placed existed. Then a large group came, passer-bys, and they were looking for a place to celebration the earth, life, love. They saw this place, loved it's beauty, it's pristine nature... and decided it was the 'perfect place' to have their celebration in this spot.

So they came and they sang and danced and ate and drank and made love all evening long into the dawn until they passed out from the celebrating. Then one by one, as dawn arrived, they slowly left the area to reform their group.

As they left, they left behind all their mess and the one pristine place was now ruined: trampled flowers, broken bushes … trash, waste products, holocaust everywhere. They came into a wonderful spot, and left it in ruins… and they never even looked back, or stopped to pick up one piece of trash. They just left it there for those that would come after them as they reformed their group to go off and find another 'perfect place' for their celebration.

We were shocked to see this, to see how people professing to so love the earth, life, others so much that they would destroy it all – to celebration it's beauty. Shocked at the destruction, and blatant disregard for their own actions and aware that the only thing the were concerned about … was that they have their fun, their celebrations.

...

I’ve had that dream probably 10 years ago or better. And yet, the shock from seeing it happening, the blatant disregard afterwards, and the casual acceptance of “that’s just how it is” has never faded for me and I'm sorry because your reply, reading the description of your celebrations - brought back the memory of this dream.

There was a simple truth from the heart of this dream and it was this:

It’s not that the ‘world’ (or people like myself) want the celebrations of the all the various peoples to stop … only to take place responsibly rather than destructively. Which is based on the understanding that our daily living should be a daily celebration of life. And that none of this needs to harm any other.

I have this knowing inside that this can be so, be done, accomplished ... that things do NOT have to be as they are ~ and this knowing has been with me my whole life, never faded or fading... way before my dream.

That I accept things as they are does not mean that I accept that thing that we (humans) create that are destructive can not be changed to constructive for I know in my heart that is what we are here for - period, no exceptions.

But, we have to stop avoiding the problems to do so.

Thanks for commenting.
That photo of the Dead Sea is representative of only that one spot. I liked it cause it looked so 'dead'. There are a few different seascapes visible. At one point, the Sea looks like a Sea (well, a large lake is actually what it is). At another point, it is subdivided into pools for the Potassium industry. At another place, it looks like you could walk across it to Jordan.

It's shrinking alright. But it's definitely worth the visit, if ever you're in the area! The trip there is extraordinary. And next time, perhaps the topic of ecology and environment will be breakfast fare, instead of the transient nature of trying to re-capture the cultural history. – Judih

(Thanks for commenting)
You’re welcome.

And (next time, perhaps the topic of ecology and environment will be breakfast fare)
I hope so…
I know I’d love to meet Ariella Gotlieb and tour the Ein Gedi Nature Reserve. She/it seems like a kindred spirit and place for/to me.

[judih]

How many times have we seen industry destroy the balance of nature?
As soon as industry steps in to a place, or high rise buildings go up, or as soon as the population stretches natural resources, and we need to supplement our energy supplies, nature suffers.

Until we are content to keep a population that can be supported by the immediate environment, there will be incursions into the natural balance.

So, the Dead Sea has been barbarized by Industry. Since it's such a rich source of potassium for the world, it's being exploited.
Conservationists are trying to make their stand but, but... as usual, money talks.

And about energy in general - if we could wave a magic wand and magically install systems of solar energy, for example, what a weight would be lifted from the ecosystem. Sun is our most lush resource, but the money to install solar heating systems is something we don't have. Hot water is heated by the sun in most city developments, but on this kibbutz, it was more economical to use a system of natural gas to heat our hot water. More economical! How could that be? Only because we didn't have the funds to replace existing facilities with solar panels.

Your dream is idyllic - sounds like Burning Man, a viable event but transitory. Would it be so difficult to plan a viable permanent community, with re-cycling and thorough use of energy in all its forms? Buildings have been designed this way for years. What's holding us up?

When you referred to my comment about our 'celebrations' what were you referring to? Our morning discussion about re-cycling and salvaging film? Or the evening before when we heard the musicians regroup after 34 years to play and then sit back to watch the re-edited film of those scraps of scattered footage.

There wasn't much waste going on. And as good kibbutzniks, we didn't leave trash around.

The real waste is the slow disintegration of the Dead Sea due to industry. And that is not kibbutz based. It is pure capitalism - i'm not sure who heads the firms involved.

Ariella does sound vital and fascinating. There are good people, many good people, and often they're involved in outreach involving our youth, with hope that the new generation will bring awareness to the environment. And sometimes, they simply do the work as an integral part of the community. We have a few of those here.

We children of the 60s in N.America think of these things as obvious, but the 60s wasn't a movement here until just recently. It's a cultural lag, but it'll come.

[stilltrucking]

Hard for me to keep focused on enviormental issues when so much blood is flowing in the gutters. I am a not a child of the sixties. I am of another era. I woke up thinking of you the other night.

Yes Masada was a bummer. I can't help but remember that every Israeli soldier takes an oath there, or so I have read somewhere. You ought to hear the Christian Zionists over here bragging from their pulpits of their 18,000 member churches, talking about what a strong "end game" Israel has. They are no friends of Israel- imo. No matter how many "Honor Israel" nights they hold.


Take care.

I don't mind the edit at all
I wish you would delete this one for me
save me the trouble of doing it myself.

[judih]

don't you dare!
valuable comments.

This is a spot for eyewitness and your reactions are very much appreciated.
My eye often spies things specifically when your eyes (or deb's eyes) or others' eyes want to know what else is there is in order to get some context.

That's why i shifted this post from inner jams to this forum.

Israel exists not because of popularity but because of a need for a homeland.
It's almost a case of 'spell my name wrong, but at least spell my name'.
We're still fighting for the right to exist. Once we are recognized, we can clean up those gutters of blood and start nurturing the things that desperately need our attention.

[stilltrucking]

Shoot, too late. I was going to but now I can't.

Beautiful pictures
Israel is such a beautiful dream
Somehow I do believe there will be peace even now amidst all the destruction and hatred I still believe.
Me and deb were going around about patriarchal societies a couple months ago, she tells me men are not to blame but if you ask me the whole thing stinks of testosterone. I saw a great PBS show last week called The Women's Kingdom. The last matriarchal society in China. It was such a happy healthy society.

Next year in Jerusalem.

[whimsicaldeb]

The real waste is the slow disintegration of the Dead Sea due to industry. And that is not kibbutz based.It is pure capitalism - i'm not sure who heads the firms involved. -- Judih

That’s not true, and is both an in accurate statement of fact as well as a false belief.

Kibbutz's have, do, are still contributing to the continued disintegration of the dead sea. They are not the sole contributors and no one (myself included), no report has ever singled them out as such; equally no report of the situation has ever left their part in all of this out of the picture either.

Kibbutzs contribute a significant part to the problem of the dead sea’s decline, along with the all the other components that you’ve already mentioned.

It is, of course, your prerogative to continue to ignore the facts and believe otherwise … but that doesn’t change the facts, or lessen the effects kibbutz’s have in the continuation of the destruction of the dead sea.

"Tourism is the engine that will clean up the environment," Gidon proclaims, and he may be right. Gidon and his colleagues at FOEME have been working on a plan to designate the Dead Sea and the Jordan River a UNESCO World Heritage Site, and Israel, Jordan and Palestine, the stakeholders, have expressed real interest.

The designation would not only ensure proper environmental management and conservation, but would attract more tourists — religious, historical and environmental. These are the sorts of travelers who become emotionally invested in a place they visit, and become active constituents for its preservation.

Jim and I have seen this cycle in action. Over 20 years ago, we shared the first descent of the Tatshenshini River, and began taking first dozens, then hundreds of people down the river through the remote St. Elias Range of southeastern Alaska and British Columbia. When an open-pit copper mine threatened to ruin the area's beauty, the collective protests and pressure of our invested river-runners turned that river corridor into a model transboundary park.

The experience is not unique. Gidon himself earned his environmental credentials working diligently, and successfully, to save the threatened Franklin River in Australia. Now he's bringing those skills and passions to bear on a region already well-known but no less endangered.

The key to it all, Gidon believes, is as simple as the hydrological cycle. Nature tourism depends upon a healthy environment. This type of tourism, if developed properly, can become an economic alternative to agriculture, which supplies just 2 percent of Israel's GDP but accounts for 90 percent of the water diversion of the Jordan's flow. If farmers divert less, more clean water pours down the Jordan, the Dead Sea returns, and this storied ecosystem attracts more tourists.

Gidon and his compatriots have helped raise global awareness, influence governments, and engage locals in their common issue. Along the way a blueprint for larger initiatives may be drawn. If peoples of different cultures and religions can come together to peacefully manage the Jordan and its storied lakes, the Sea of Galilee and the Dead Sea, maybe they'll be able to peacefully manage everything else, and the miraculous might just become the norm.

Source:
Dead Sea Dying
Can tourists save the Holy Land's shrinking saltwater lake?
Fixing a Hole in the Holy Land
RESURRECTING THE DEAD SEA
by Richard Bangs
http://adventures.yahoo.com/b/adventures/adventures3826

90% diversion of the water for a 2% return…

In 1953, Israel constructed a dam, the Degania Gate, a few hundred feet south of this spot, to collect water from the Sea of Galilee for the National Water Carrier project. The dam reduced the Jordan’s flow to a trickle.

About five miles south of the dam, Bromberg and I enter the Degania kibbutz, one of Israel’s oldest kibbutzim, or agricultural cooperatives, founded in 1909. We bounce along a rutted dirt track through corn, tomato and avocado fields, following two giant metal pipes that siphon off some of the Jordan’s water for an extensive irrigation system. Dozens of other collective farms in the area also dip into the river. After a few minutes we arrive at a small earthen dam, where the Jordan comes to a pitiful end. On one side lies a stagnant pool covered by algae. Arusted rowboat is submerged beneath the surface. On the other side of the dam, liquid gushes from two pipes and flows down the riverbed. One flow consists of raw sewage from kibbutzim in the area. The other is saline water from springs flowing into the Sea of Galilee mixed with partially treated sewage from Tiberias, captured and removed to decrease the lake’s salinity. The Jordan’s once annual flow of 343 billion gallons of fresh water has now been replaced by 40 billion gallons or so of mostly sewage and saline water. Irrigation “is one of the main reasons that the Dead Sea is dying,” Bromberg tells me.

Source:
The Dying of the Dead Sea
The ancient salt sea is the site of a looming environmental catastrophe
By Joshua Hammer
Smithsonian Magazine October 2005
http://www.smithsonianmagazine.com/issu ... eadsea.php

Like anything is this world, in order to fix a problem … you first have to admit there is one, and see your part in it.

Move this thread, my comments, where ever you will
spin this however you wish ...

It doesn't, won't, change the facts.

[stilltrucking]

Speaking of facing problems and polution. The internal engine has got to go. No matter what some egg head professor says about alternative fuels.

Check this out if you would please.

http://www.studioeight.tv/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=7484

[whimsicaldeb]

additional information about Ein Gedi kibbutz from the same Smithsonian article:

From the first years of Israel’s existence as a Jewish state, for example, when collective farming transformed much of it into fertile vineyards and vegetable fields, both Labor and Likud governments have bestowed generous water subsidies on the nation’s farmers. The results have been disastrous: today, agriculture accounts for just 3 percent of Israel’s gross national product and uses up to half of its fresh water. Recently, Uri Sagie, chairman of Israel’s national water company, told a conference of Israeli farmers that a growing and irreversible gap between production and consumption looms. “The water sources are being depleted without the deficit being restored,” he warned. Jordan lavishes similar water subsidies on its farmers with similar consequences: the kingdom takes about 71 billion gallons of water a year from the Yarmouk River and channels it into the King Abdullah Canal, constructed by USAID in the 1970s to provide irrigation for the JordanValley; Syria takes out another 55 billion gallons. The result is near-total depletion of the lower Jordan’s main source of water.

Several days later on another outing with Bromberg, we are hiking through the Ein Gedi Nature Reserve, on a ridge 600 feet above the Dead Sea. Astream of fresh water, originating in an underground spring deep in the JudeanDesert, rushes through a steep canyon dense with tamarisk, pine, birch and oleander. We ascend to the top of the canyon, where a cascade tumbles down sandstone cliffs into a cool, clear pool.

Yet not a single drop of that spring water—some 114 million gallons a year—reaches the Dead Sea. Just outside the nature reserve, the Ein Gedi kibbutz takes it, bottling some for a popular brand of mineral water and using the rest to irrigate the kibbutz grounds and botanical gardens, a sea of green amid the desert’s desolation. To Bromberg and other environmentalists, kibbutz policy is rank hypocrisy. “The people of the Ein Gedi kibbutz are the first to complain about sinkholes along the shore,” Bromberg says. “But they don’t blame themselves for contributing to the problem.”

Ein Gedi’s residents deny any responsibility for the Dead Sea’s plight—and lash out both at green groups such as Friends of the Earth and at the Israeli Knesset (Parliament), which recently sought to crack down on the kibbutz’s water usage. “It’s garbage what they’re saying. If you take all water from Ein Gedi’s spring, it’s a small drop in the Dead Sea,” Merav Ayalon, Ein Gedi’s spokesperson, told me. “The problem isn’t us. It’s the Israeli government.” Ayalon blames the Water Commission and the Agriculture Ministry for a shortsighted policy that, she says, has wrecked the local economy. “Our date palms are dying because of the sinkholes,” she says. “Our farmers can’t work [in some groves] because it’s gotten too dangerous. People have come close to being killed. We almost had to close the kibbutz, and the government does nothing. It has no policy to save the Dead Sea.”

Yet not a single drop of that spring water—some 114 million gallons a year—reaches the Dead Sea. Just outside the nature reserve, the Ein Gedi kibbutz takes it, bottling some for a popular brand of mineral water and using the rest to irrigate the kibbutz grounds and botanical gardens, a sea of green amid the desert’s desolation.

Takes a lot of water to keep a lawn green and lush in a desert, anyone from Arizona or New Mexico (or even Texas) know the truth, the facts of this - and can tell you the same thing.

Your pictures Judih ...





they speak the truth of Bromberg's words ... they speak the truth beyond your own words even in this (and the other) thread.

[MrGuilty]

I can't log in as stilltrucking for some reason deb. I was going to delete that post abouve about electric cars ans post it to the earth day string. It does not belong here.

sorry j

[judih]

The Ashkelon Desalination plant was completed in August 2005, a few months after the Smithsonian article.

I mentioned that our kibbutz has been recipient to this water for a few months now. Finally we are off the main water pipe that has been supplying the country with water.

Change is happening and will continue.
As for recognizing the problem, we recognize the problem of depleting the Dead Sea. But industry and as the Smithsonian article points out agriculture are high priorities on the country's agenda.

Here is an excerpt of an article on the plant now supplying us with water:

Ashkelon Desalination Plant, Seawater Reverse Osmosis (SWRO) Plant, Israel, Israel

The new Ashkelon seawater reverse osmosis (SWRO) plant - the largest desalination plant of its kind in the world - commenced initial production in August 2005, less than 30 months after construction began. Initially running at around 30% to 40% capacity, it will ultimately provide an annual 100 million m³ of water, roughly 5% to 6% of Israel's total water needs or around 15% of the country's domestic consumer demand.

Built by VID, a special purpose joint-venture company of IDE Technologies, Vivendi Water and Dankner-Ellern Infrastructure, the plant design includes membrane desalination units and facilities for seawater pumping, brine removal, raw water pre-treatment and product water treatment. In addition, the project also required the construction of workshop and laboratory buildings, access roads and a dedicated gas turbine power station.

In total, the project cost approximately $250 million and was funded by a mixture of equity (24%) and debt (77%). The overall revenue over the period of the contract will be in the region of $825 million.

BACKGROUND
North Africa and the Middle East holds more than 6% of the global population, but less than 2% of the world's renewable fresh water. In common with other countries in this, the planet's most water-scarce region, Israel has chronic problems over water resources. Setting out to address them, in 2000, Israel launched a Desalination Master Plan.

This strategy called for the construction of a series of plants along the Mediterranean coast, to enable an annual total of 400 million m³ of desalinated water to be produced by 2005, chiefly for urban consumption. According to the plan, production is intended to rise to 750 million m³ by 2020.

http://www.water-technology.net/projects/israel/

[whimsicaldeb]

What steps has Askelon SWRO Plant done to offset the environmental impact that was laid out in 2004?
http://www.ipcri.org/watconf/papers/mutaz.pdf

I didn't see anything on the link you provided that mentions how (or if) they addressed the environmental impact. Was it addressed, and if so how?

...

The US also is using desalination plants - with environmental safe guards. Example: The Tampa Bay
http://www.tampabaywater.org/watersuppl ... otect.aspx

Environmental protections, safeguards and monitoring ensure there are no adverse effects from the desalination plant.

Permitting

The Florida Department of Environmental Protection’s (DEP) permitting process was lengthy and extensive. Over an 18-month period, DEP reviewed scientific research and public comments regarding the desalination plant and eventually more than 20 environmental and construction permits were required from local, state and federal agencies. The plant’s operations plans have met or surpassed every requirement for every permit.

Other agencies, organizations and citizens concerned with protecting Tampa Bay, including the Agency on Bay Management, the Hillsborough County Water Team, the Audubon Society, the Tampa Baywatch and Tampa Estuary Program also reviewed and commented on submitted materials. None of the groups is opposed to the Tampa Bay Seawater Desalination facility.

Safeguards

The plant has two protection systems to monitor the salinity of the source water, desalinated drinking water and concentrated seawater discharged back into the bay. Measurements will be taken in several areas in and around the plant.

An early warning system alarm will sound if the blending ratio of the seawater being returned to Tampa Bay falls below the normal blending ratio of 70-to-1.

The plant’s second alarm system will instruct plant operators to check, adjust and if needed, shut down affected areas of the plant if the salinity level of the discharge reaches the DEP’s salinity discharge permit level.

Monitoring

Tampa Bay Water conducts permit-required hydrobiological monitoring programs (HBMPs) for the Tampa Bay Seawater Desalination Plant as well as the Tampa Bypass Canal/Hillsborough River and the Alafia River. These comprehensive monitoring programs were developed to determine if initial predictions of environmental effects of these various water supplies are accurate and provide an early warning of potential changes.

The HBMPs monitor water quality, vegetation, benthic invertebrates, fish and other parameters in the Lower Hillsborough River, Alafia River, Palm River/Tampa Bypass Canal, McKay Bay and areas in Hillsborough Bay near Apollo Beach and the Big Bend power plant. The HBMPs are coordinated with other agency monitoring programs to maximize use of available data.

These monitoring programs use recent and historical data to develop a comprehensive baseline report against which post-operational data can be compared to identify any potential changes or trends.

Costing about $1.2 million annually, thousands of samples are collected, including continuous salinity measures every 15 minutes. The HBMP reports and related documents are provided to regulatory agencies and posted to Tampa Bay Water’s web site.

Tampa Bay ’s Salinity

Although the plant’s discharge is roughly twice as salty as Tampa Bay, it does not increase the bay’s salinity because it is diluted 70-to-1 in up to 1.4 billion gallons of cooling water per day from Tampa Electric’s Big Bend Power Station before being discharged back into the bay. Salinity in the plant’s discharge is, on average, only 1.0 to 1.5 percent higher than Tampa Bay’s. This slight increase in salinity falls well within the natural, yearly salinity fluctuations of Tampa Bay, which vary from 16 to 32 parts per thousand, or by up to 100 percent, depending on the weather and the season.

A Cumulative Impact Analysis for Master Water Plan projects that used a desalination plant with twice the production capacity (50 mgd) of Tampa Bay Seawater Desalination as its model found that even if all of Tampa Bay Water’s proposed Master Water Plan projects were implemented simultaneously, the salinity of Tampa Bay would still not increase beyond its normal, seasonal variations.

A U.S. Geological Survey of the Big Bend Power Station area determined that salinity will not build up in Tampa Bay because it flushes often. “Water Transport in Lower Hillsborough Bay, Florida, 1995-1996,” found that each time the tide changes, more than 200 times as much water enters or leaves the bay as circulates through the power plant. The report also found that enough water flows in and out of the bay system near Big Bend to properly dilute and flush the plant’s discharges, further preventing any long-term salinity build-up.

Does the Askelon SWRO Plant have similar safeguards in effect, and if so could you provide a link to this information?

Thank you.

...
On a personal note:

As for recognizing the problem, we recognize the problem of depleting the Dead Sea. - Judih

Yes, you do. But you still refuse to say that Kibbutz (yours included) have a part in it.

In addition, why didn't you say all this that you're saying now, in the very beginning when I first asked? That was what I was asking about in my original posting.

Why did it take me posting all these other articles showing the connection of how kibbutzs and their agriculture are part of the cause of the Dead Sea's delcine?

Even with all that you've replied, your still NOT saying ...

The real waste is the slow disintegration of the Dead Sea due to industry. And that is not kibbutz based. It is pure capitalism - i'm not sure who heads the firms involved. -- Judih

and now ...

Change is happening and will continue.
As for recognizing the problem, we recognize the problem of depleting the Dead Sea. But industry and as the Smithsonian article points out agriculture are high priorities on the country's agenda.

that Kibbutzs have anything to do with it. Instead you are saying the problem is being addressed ~ but even this is only AFTER 've challenged you on the subject.

With everything you've posted and said so you've still never admit culpability! You've never directly replied "yes, kibbutz water uses do and are part of the problem."

Instead, you've expertly danced around the culpabilty issue of the kibbutzs. Just like what Bush&Co about their areas of culpability I might add.

BTW … you like synchronisity?

This came in my e-mailbox this morning ... it’s today’s Heartmath's daily quote:

"Change takes but an instant. It's the resistance to change that can take a lifetime."

- Hebrew Proverb

uhhuh
So true.