pretentiousness in the arts world

Post by **Doreen Peri** » March 31st, 2008, 8:23 am

Why is the arts world filled with such pretentiousness? I hate pseudo-intellectualism and snobbery.

i wrote a piece about this once. Can't find it.

I was thinking of working in the arts scene but I don't know if I can handle the snobby pretentious bullshit.

I'm a barefoot jeans 'n' t-shirt artist.

What's with the affected accents, expensive champagne, tuxedos, and name dropping?

i don't get it.

Post by **Lightning Rod** » March 31st, 2008, 10:15 am

doreen, it sounds like you've been to an art opening recently

at some point you have to distinguish between 'art' and 'the art business'

people who attend art shows and stand around making pithy comments and drinking their chablis are not usually artists

the best artists I have known are not pretentious at all, in fact they are very humble

real artists in any genre have no time for posturing, they are either covered with paint, sweaty from the dance, or have been awake for three days trying to finish the fucking poem.

Post by **Doreen Peri** » March 31st, 2008, 10:26 am

Actually, no, I haven't been to an art opening lately. But I know exactly what you're saying.

But I don't agree that all artists are not pretentious.

What inspired this bit of disgust was my reading on another site. Pretentious poets. Flaunting their pseudo-intellectual snobbery.
lol

Seriously. I pictured them standing around sipping their chablis in semi-formal evening wear.

Post by **Lightning Rod** » March 31st, 2008, 10:40 am

scroll back doreen
I didn't say that ALL artists are humble
I said I had found THE BEST artists to be humble
there is a big difference in those two statements

yes, I know the poets you mean
they are the ones who are sure to include something in every poem referring to greek mythology

Post by **Doreen Peri** » March 31st, 2008, 10:42 am

Ahhhh..... OK. Yeah. Good point. True enough. Thanks.

Still, I don't fit in that world and I don't like it.

Somebody needs to pour the champagne over their heads.

....

wow.. you edited your reply.

OK. I will reply to your edit. No, those are not the poets I'm referring to. I love greek mythology! I think those type of images are wonderful!

WTF?

Post by **Lightning Rod** » March 31st, 2008, 10:51 am

I love greek mythology too

but some amateur poets try to use it as a badge of erudition

poetry isn't about greek mythology, it's about life

(greek mythology certainly talks about life, but references to it in contemporary poetry are limp)

Post by **Doreen Peri** » March 31st, 2008, 11:05 am

Well, yeah ok... amateur poets couldn't use it well. Hell, I'm no amateur and I can't use it well 'cause I don't know much about it. Well, I have used the image of Sisyphus more times than I can count 'cause that's the story of my life... heh...

But there are very talented skilled poets like our very own constantine who is a scholar of greek mythology and who uses those images in a wonderful and effective way..... they make some great metaphors about life!

So, that's all I'm saying. You can't lump poets together by saying if you use greek mythology you're pretentious. That's just bullshit.

.....

Let's get back to the subject at hand.

I'm talking about the snobby artists you described at the art opening.

Sure, there is art as a business and some of those people who attend the art opening are not artists, but many of them are.

I'm sure you've also known snobby pretentious musicians. I have.

It just doesn't fit to me. I mean, in MY arts world, like you say, we're covered with paint and sweaty from dance and dirty from back stage dust, yanno? That's the REAL arts world!

OK... let me use another example.

Do you remember when we did a show and I had asked all the poets for their bios and I had to stand up there and read the fricking bios?

To me, listing the publications you've been published in, the many schools you've attended, the many degrees you have, etc... to be read aloud at an on stage performance event is not only tacky, it's boring, pretentious, and snobby.

Let's get to the poetry, already! And make it ugly and mean and REAL and heart-wrenching and disturbing and funny as hell!

That's REAL art!

Your resume isn't real art. It's bullshit.

Post by **Lightning Rod** » March 31st, 2008, 11:11 am

you know my feeling on this
all resumes are exercises in creative writing
for some poets, it's their masterpiece...haha

Post by **Doreen Peri** » March 31st, 2008, 11:30 am

heh... Right!

Plus, even if they're true, who wants to hear a laundry list of publication and education credits that goes on for 5 minutes? I don't give a damn about that shit. Doesn't impress me one iota. Bores me to death.

If the poet can speak, if he or she has something to say, if the words are music, if the dancer's body becomes another instrument in the symphony, if the painting moves me to see through another person's even only for a moment, if the actor suspends time and makes me believe I'm experiencing a true life story unfolding before my eyes.... these are the things that make art art.

Not their masters degrees or phDs, not a tuxedo and a stem glass full of $1,000-a-bottle champagne, not how many years they spent in Europe studying ballet.

I'm telling you, there is LOTS of snobbery in the dance world, too! Believe me!

Remember the movie about Jackson Pollack? It wasn't only the people at his art openings who were pretentious and snobby. HE WAS TOO!

heh

A pretty good representation of what I'm talking about, that film. He even used his fame and stature in the arts community as a way to get young women to fuck him. I mean, come on!

I hate that kinda crap.

Post by **Lightning Rod** » March 31st, 2008, 12:13 pm

doreen, I was with you until the Pollack remark
which of your favorite rock stars hasn't used his fame and stature to get fucked by young women? that's not pretentiousness, that's ego and opportunity.

Post by **Doreen Peri** » March 31st, 2008, 12:20 pm

ok... but he was also pretentious and snobby

(in the movie, anyway... i never met him in person

)

point was, he didn't have much stature in the arts community until later on. But he used his pretentious ego to take advantage of young girls

there's nothing more pretentious than a huge ego

i'm writing a poem about it.

Post by **Lightning Rod** » March 31st, 2008, 1:04 pm

no,
pretentiousness is something for people with small egos
people with healthy egos don't need to pretend

Post by **Dave The Dov** » March 31st, 2008, 1:49 pm

Mom dad please don't fight! I've been to many an art shows and oh man talk about the reals and the snobs!!!!
_________________
Dexter Forum

Post by **stilltrucking** » March 31st, 2008, 2:12 pm

I am not sure it is a fight dave
maybe it is
I know how you feel though
My parents fought constantly
and I felt like a pawn in their battles.

I thought this was a pretty interesting discussion.
But it is hard for me to believe that some men would sink so low
just to get laid.
Was pollack a child molester

take advantage of young girls

How old were those girls, 15,16, 18, or 25?

Post by **Lightning Rod** » March 31st, 2008, 2:22 pm

as far as I know, truck
pollack's conquests were legal tender

which is more than I can say for mick jagger and stephen tyler and peter yarrow

cradle robbing is a matter of perspective, I guess

Studio8 - Uniting the Arts

pretentiousness in the arts world

pretentiousness in the arts world

Who is online