Sting: Obama best person to handle world's 'mess'

Post by **Arcadia** » December 29th, 2009, 5:52 pm

as far as I know, Sting always liked to talk about and be involved somehow in international politics, so I´m not surprised he talked about Obama. It´s his opinion, it´s ok! (besides he´s a brit!

) . But I still enjoy very much listening him singing -and also seeing him-!

Post by **hester_prynne** » December 30th, 2009, 2:19 am

I'm on the fence with this now. I really hear what Non Sum is saying. I feel it. I feel stung. Distrustful and skeptical, and in a tiny little crevice of my soul i'm still hopeful that Obama will not let us down, despite the fact that he already has....

H

Non Sum · Post by **Non Sum** » December 30th, 2009, 9:36 am

"Always be loyal to your country. Never be loyal to the people in power, because they’re conning you everyday."Howard Davidowitz, 27 Aug 2009

MTMynd: Those that have problems with him can be grouped into 1) the agitators, 2) the jealous, 3) the suspicious, and 4) the doubters.

NS: When it comes to watching politicians, "suspicion, agitation, and doubt," are your best friends. Sure, I like Obama -- voted for him. Heck, I'm a screaming, pinko liberal from Boston who votes Dem 99% of the time. But, today's media centers on pop icons, and all that glitter can (purposively) distract, just as the circuses did so well for ancient Rome. Rather than letting the stardust of personalities fill your vision, try to keep your eye on the ball of current events and the strong currents trending towards future events. It isn't about 'who' is in power, but what is being done (and not done) with that power.

Is Gov power continuing to grow at the expense of the people?
Are wars, conducted by invading non-threatening nations, being initiated or continued?
Will this country continue, even after the proposed healthcare bills, to be the only 1st world nation not providing nationalized medical care for its citizens?
Will this country continue to maintain a war dept whose budget is a near equal to the combined war budgets of every nation on earth?
Why do major corporations & banks still get $billion handouts while small businesses, and unemployed individuals get nothing, or next to it?

Sure we've got a nicer, smarter, better group of people who are saying better words in this administration, but what does that matter, so long as the same old policies continue? I guess, I'm just being "jealous."

Post by **stilltrucking** » December 30th, 2009, 10:36 am

No doubt about it the United States is going down big time. We are doomed unless we can find the right politician to lead us out of this. How long has all this been going on N.S. I mean did this all just happen in the last couple of years or were things better back in the good old days.

Maybe we need to get back to the America of Woodrow Wilson.

What did you expect man. Where were you during the campaign. Even a fool like me heard what Obama was saying.

Don't worry be happy Keep Cool with Coolidge.
We are a decadent empire. And that is a fact. And Europe and Japan have taken the best and left us with the rest.

I wish I knew who to vote for next time. I guess the person who raises the most money. Maybe we should just move the whole election process to ebay. The way the Roman army used to auction off the empire.

Yes I am jealous too. Jealous of the countries like Switzerland. And Norway.

Situation is bad. The policies are worse. Best elect Sarah Palin next time so we can bring the roof down and start over.

So you wanted change
Any suggestions on what to do about it.
I am resigned to it. Hell even Thomas Jefferson knew.

But I take comfort in the fact that god is just.
And the American people will reap what they have sown. Right?

there I go again sarcastic jack
you know true believers scare the dog shit out of me
all I can see is how things would have been worse if Obama lost.
We need a revolution no doubt. Another Tea Party maybe.

Post by **stilltrucking** » December 30th, 2009, 11:08 am

I don't know what to say about all this Cecil. I get too emotional.

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I am not loyal to Obama. I was disillusioned with him before the election.

George Santayana: Wisdom comes by disillusionment

And what good is wisdom except to weary the soul.

For in much wisdom is much grief: and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow. .

Vote for Sarah Palin and the know nothing party next time.

You know Cecil I would have bet you ten to one that McCain was going to win. That shows I should shut up and stay out of this. I have no political perspicacity whats so ever.

And I don't think the people around Obama are better looking either. old snake eyes Connie Rice is hotter than Hillary. I used to have masturbation fantasies about those boots of hers

Post by **one of those jerks** » December 30th, 2009, 11:50 am

Just ignore me N.S.
You know I am one of those jerks who...
I always wondered if the guy who wrote the Tibetan Book of The Dead was familiar with the Old Testament.

Post by **mtmynd** » December 30th, 2009, 11:55 am

Hes'... NS... I understand you're concerns... they are the concerns of so many who would like someone to pull out a magic wand, pass it over every flaw and obstacle the U.S. has before it and in an instant - whoosh! everything returns to an idyllic, peaceful and serene country where everyone that wants to work and everyone that needs to work will have their wishes fulfilled ... a country that treats every citizen with equality, respect and the American Way! Hurray, hurray... our day has come. We have restored our goodness and our wealth and our ability to solve every problem from A to Z...

But everyone of us, no matter who we are or what our backgrounds are, need to get a grip... hold on, mother! we are in for some wild times and they are not all going to be grand and wonderful. The changes this country and indeed, the world is going to be monumental... unlike anything we've witnessed in our lifetimes. Yes! I am not full of shit.

Nobody, not even Barack Obama (despite our desires) has a crystal ball revealing the future clearly and with answers to how it will end... this crippling change of reality that we are all involved in. Barack Obama, however, with his 'cool', his reserve and ability to remain calm, is the type of character that the times require to get the United States through these turbulent (and more to come) times.

You ask about the wars, and justifiably so. Nobody likes war but the warriors. Imagine, for a moment, if Obama said no more wars.. we are not participating in any way in war on foreign soil. Every military personnel throughout the Mid-East and every military personnel throughout Europe .. every one outside our borders will return to our country... How do you imagine this scenario would play out? Who would move in to take our place in those areas unable to defend themselves? And would the new shift in military might be our allies?

As you well know, the Mid-East holds the key to power... the fuel to make power happen... oil. No mystery. Who do you believe would move in to gain control over that resource that fuel the world? Today, it would be China... with it's billion man army. How would that shift in military power and defense change the world's political stage?

Maybe America will not be able in the future to continue defending our allies, our resources from various areas of the globe. But IF you were President and you came into this office knowing these facts... how would you handle them? What would be your plan of action to keep America safe, the country you gave oath to protect and defend... a country that has a future that will offer our citizens their Constitutional Rights?

I would have no answer to these questions if they were asked of me. But when I see this man, this hu'man being, Barack Obama, there is something much deeper behind that man that has a sincere desire to do the best of his ability to steer this huge, bulky, massively unwieldy country which has lost it's direction, into a future that will reward it's citizens with peace, security, health and dignity.

We may not see the amount of wealth we seen strewn about our country as we have these past 20 years or so... they may be over as we knew it. This will prove to be extremely problematic to many who live to amass wealth beyond their ability to utilize it. The America of the past was generous to those who played the game of Hyper-Capitalism.. rewarding them with lower taxes, prestige, honor... all the accouterments given to Kings and Queens. the Princes and Princesses of yesteryear... those days may well be fading into the horizon as mere memories of what once was.

We generally don't readily embrace loss, unless it's a dis-ease or complete burden to our well-being... but what is in store for the U.S. of tomorrow, will not... cannot be the same as it once was. There is a brand new world with brand new visions that will be led, more and more, by brand new leadership that understands this future on the other side of where we are now. It's a future full of promise that was given to us in our Constitution... Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness is not dead, but it has been deathly ill for many years for many of our citizens... choking under the stifling stench of greed and lies that have undermined the goodness of this country.

We seem doubt and brush away this man, Obama... he hasn't changed our world one bit in one year... he's a sham... a liar... another shameless politician out for himself... nothing changes... it's all the same shit... who care about the little guy out here?

We've heard all that for years and years.... nothing ever changes. If WE don't change, change will never happen. But as long as we fear change, you are right! Change will never happen. Don't harp about no change, my friends... change yourself, remake yourself, live lighter, live smarter, become more knowledgeable about your world. Those a simple beginnings that all of can do... no magic, no tricks, do lies, no deceptions... just plain old honesty in our everyday life. Start there. You'll begin to see a new you with new hopes, new dreams, new visions of what is going on outside you... change that is wonderful and promising... not fearful and scary... Sure, it takes time... it takes hope (re: hope is the desire that instinct is right)... it take a sense of humor (don't lose that!)... most of all it takes YOU to change yourself... so others will change with you.

Let the Obama-man do his thing... all your complaining and bitching ain't gonna change what he has to do... on the contrary, all that shit so many keep spilling only hampers him on his job... a job he respects and will do well.... not only for the country, but also for his wife and children.

[enough... as he steps down from the podium...

]

Post by **Barry** » December 30th, 2009, 1:17 pm

Cecil gets another You ROCK!!! award for this.

Peace,
Barry

Non Sum · Post by **Non Sum** » December 30th, 2009, 3:12 pm

Good Grief!

You two guys sure get up a head of steam. These levels of passion, and hope, are nothing I can equal. What is it, Viagra? I ought to get me some of that, because from where I am sitting what we have today is what we had yesterday, with the future inexorably heading in the same old direction it always has for every other empire I've ever read, or heard, about. I have to fight the sense of apathy.

StillTrucking: We are doomed unless we can find the right politician to lead us out of this.

NS: Here, clearly stated, is a major contributing factor to the growth of Gov over citizen, 'The Saviour Mentality.' "If only we had some King Arthur to step forward and save us from the Saxon dogs." Apparently, Cecil has found him, and seen the sword being extracted from a stone. Citizens give up their power gladly to those who swear to lead and protect them. Give them enough fear of the puffed up "enemy" (e.g. terrorists, commies, jews, etc.), and they will gladly give up their: rights, treasure, and children's lives to any glorious (religious or political) salvation. It's lazy, dependent, thinking.

To point out worse leaders (potential or past), or a long history of being conned by others, in no way justifies a bad current policy not being declared as such. It is the duty of an active, concerned, citizenry to speak up and criticize what is flawed policy. Equating those criticisms to claims for perfection in order to make them appear ridiculous is only specious fallacy disguised as an actual rebuttle.

MT: But IF you were President and you came into this office knowing these facts... how would you handle them?
ST: Any suggestions on what to do about it.

NS: Damn right, there are many changed national policies that should be "suggested," and "handled" immediately.
For starters, shut down the world empire and its wars of invasion forthwith. Who do you seriously think is going to invade the US? So long as we invade other nations, we are "the evil empire."

Don't worry Cecil, the oil will continue to flow. The Chinese are not so stupid to want to occupy the land of suicide bombers, and if they are as dumb as we were, they deserve what they get for their short stay.

Have faith in the world markets. Sellers will always want to sell to the highest bidder. The US does not need to play world policeman. If there is an international problem, let the international community deal with it to the degree that they care. I would institute a national policy of 'military' isolationism. No more bases on foreign soil.

I would criminalize, and demilitarize, terrorist acts. I would act on threats (natural & human) proportional to the statistical risk. I would scrap the Patriot Act. I would institute national health insurance. I would make all state education free and public for all ages, to any extent the student shows a capacity for. This because, education = national wealth, happiness & strength. I would enforce all 'mala in se' crimes, and end all 'mala prohibita' crimes. I would reform the criminal "justice" system, and end all capital punishment. Cripes, I could go on forever saying what we all know needs to be done, yet hope some saviour will do for us because we can only 'hope' but never dare complain and agitate.
NS (National Saviour)

Post by **mtmynd** » December 30th, 2009, 5:19 pm

:lol: you maka me laff, whiteboy!

NS: 'Damn right, there are many changed national policies that should be "suggested," and "handled" immediately.
For starters, shut down the world empire'...(blah, blah, blah...)

Excellent summary of what you would do, NS... if you were emperor!

But, dammit, man, unfortunately for me and a handful of others, you are not the emperor within this game of "what would you do?" In order to play fairly the game must be played according to the Rules of America... that is where the difficulty lies with our man, B.O., NS.

As long as our country runs according the the Constitutional rules set forth by the forefathers, we can never have all the things we want or need... we can only have samplings here and there from the Political Banquet set before us. Even the President, who ever that may be, is unable to have all things their way.

Now this may distraught many of us... in particular those that see what needs to be done to save the country from itself. But since these outspoken amongst the citizenry feel hopeless against the status quo they counterattack by being either : 1) the agitators, 2) the jealous, 3) the suspicious, and 4) the doubters (btw: the jealous within this group is certainly not you, NS, but the opposing party who are blatantly jealous at the recognition and respect Obama generally receives).

NS: "Don't worry Cecil, the oil will continue to flow. The Chinese are not so stupid to want to occupy the land of suicide bombers, and if they are as dumb as we were, they deserve what they get for their short stay."

Tis not I doing the worrying, my friend, but those who presently control the flow of the oil. A treasure such as this can easily pay any price for the precious resource knowing in the end, it will be the public who will pay the difference. Right now it appears with each passing day China and it's mammoth machine of commerce and military plus financial power may soon hold the cards against the Exxon/Mobil's of our country. It is currently a matter of how much of an advantage China will have by pumping their own. As you know, "Sellers will always want to sell to the highest bidder," and the highest bidder is the one with the deepest pockets.

NS: "The US does not need to play world policeman."

True. But without playing this game, the shift of power becomes all the more likely. Who will defend who? becomes the question of the moment when and if the U.S. withdraws all military worldwide.
It's a large financial market out there being watched over by the U.S., with our troops in some 40 countries or so. They are not there solely for freedom and human rights, as you well know.

And with that, I continue to stand behind President Obama. I may in the end be sorely disappointed, but I would much rather wait until that time rather than express that disappointment towards the man who has held this office for one year. That disappointment is much too premature at this stage of the Presidency, IMHO. How many years has our elected government twisted and screwed with us? We can not logically expect this one man to erase all the problems in such a short period of time, can we?

Post by **mnaz** » December 30th, 2009, 5:37 pm

mtmynd wrote:Today is not the day of 20 years ago where the U.S. reigned supreme and admired for its accomplishments. The country is being completely redefined and rebuilt... for many from scratch.

Well, maybe. But I'm having a harder time seeing than some folks I suppose. Seems we're awfully damn busy doing more to "secure" and rebuild our foreign oil/gas puppet states in the Middle East than rebuilding our own systems. The new health care bill is inadequate from what I've heard-- too much of a sellout to Big Insurance. At least Mr. O tried to do something, right? True. But how strongly did he lead on the issue? Did he truly stand for Change when he ran into stiff opposition from the Insurance lobby? Or are we simply too broke at this point? So whored out to major corporate interests throughout Congress and major media that we'll simply never be able to raise corporate taxes high enough to generate the revenue required to pay for a decent comprehensive health care program?

There is a lot to be accomplished to steady the boat and although the situation requires urgency, it also requires a steady and fearless approach to do so. Obama is the right man in the right time.

Except at some point, if he actually wants to more effectively break through logjams of Congressional power politics, he may need to exhibit even more "fearlessness" than he has so far.

Post by **mtmynd** » December 30th, 2009, 5:53 pm

Cecil -

And with that, I continue to stand behind President Obama. I may in the end be sorely disappointed, but I would much rather wait until that time rather than express that disappointment towards the man who has held this office for one year. That disappointment is much too premature at this stage of the Presidency, IMHO. How many years has our elected government twisted and screwed with us? We can not logically expect this one man to erase all the problems in such a short period of time, can we?

Post by **stilltrucking** » December 30th, 2009, 6:09 pm

I deserved that smart ass crack about viagra.

nice blue chemicals

I should apologize to the fair ones here for that vulgar comment about Condi Rice. And it is a lie too. I never had masturbation fantasies about her boots. I was thinking about her sitting on the crapper with her knickers down to her knees and I wondered if her shat stank.
Sorry for all the Freudian shit sisters. Where is Jean Genet when I need him.

One of those chick flick art films I saw in another life time. Peter Falk gave the greatest political speech of all time as the Police Commissioner.

Money talks bulls shit walks
here in these later days
or at least my later days
I only take responsibility for my words
And I sure do not want to offend anyone especially any atheists.

I am a sick puppy

I am done hijacking Cecil. I just wanted to apologize to SooZen and hopes she pardons my shitty sense of humor.

And I am humming
the night they drove old dixie down
the bells were ringing
I don't care if the money's no good

Keeps coming back to money for me.

I wonder what happened to Reverend Wright do they stay in touch? I suppose Wright was his father figure. I read somewhere that Obama now has five spiritual advisers.
around the country.

Post by **Barry** » December 30th, 2009, 6:45 pm

NS: 'The Saviour Mentality.' "If only we had some King Arthur to step forward and save us from the Saxon dogs."

King Arthur and other saviours should be viewed through the lens of metaphor. While it may be argued that they don't actually exist, they do represent something. They are stand-ins, figurative personages put in place of the literal person.

Were the true unvarnished life story of Guatama Siddhartha (the Buddha) known to all, many might be disappointed. Were the true unvarnished life story of Jesus the Christ known to all as well, same deal. Were the true unvarnished life stories of Ghandi, Mother Theresa or MLK known to all, much disappointment and even disapproval might be felt.

Some of these names are from so far back in time that it's doubted they even existed. They have become personages more than persons. All we now have are the metaphors they've become. Others are more recent, yet still they are becoming more personage than person, more metaphorically extant than realistically.

Metephors, however, do stand for something. There is a reason they exist. When one sees a person so agile or sprightly they wish to add emphasis to their description they may use metaphor, as in, "He is a deer." They don't literally mean he is a dear. They mean it figuratively. Someone very strong might be called a tiger. Again, not literally, figuratively.

I point this out because of your use of the term 'Saviour mentality,' as if the concept is wholly bad and never good. While I myself would welcome a return to the collective understanding of metaphoric figures as figuratively representative of aspects of the human condition - "good" aspects in the case of "saviour" figures and "bad" aspects in the case of "demonic" figures - I cannot welcome an irradication from the collective consciousness of all metaphoric or figurative personages (not that that's what I read you as suggesting) and their replacement with...what? Real people? If we truly knew about real people we would quickly find in them disfavor. That's just life.

Saviour figures, real or imagined, represent hope, the hope we all hope for, the good we all feel and want to cultivate in ourselves and believe in in others. They have there place even in "modern" society.

Yes, I believe in King Arthur. I believe that as a boy he pulled the sword Excalibur from the stone when none of the strong men of the realm could do it. I believe that he grew up to lead his people in a noble and just fashion, and that he brought some light into their lives. The reality of the person who actually existed likely pales in comparisson to the personage of my belief. Nonetheless, I still choose to believe.

I believe Barak Obama, given time, will also be such a personage, while understanding the reality of the person is no different than my own: He's just some dude trying to get through his life best he can like everyone else. For both reasons, I support him.

Peace,
Barry

Post by **hester_prynne** » December 30th, 2009, 8:15 pm

"and in a tiny little crevice of my soul i'm still hopeful that Obama will not let us down, despite the fact that he already has...." HP

I see and have seen in the past year so many opportunities for change. But instead we still get the waffling and caving in to the current status quo. Turning the other cheek is a good thing yes, but not always! When someone blatently shits on your country like Bush and Cheney did, (and Cheney is still doing this!) then accountability and discipline are warrented, and will effect change in that the message gets out that there is no tolerance of such actions.

Think about it. Wall Street bail out? Retirement money stolen by gambling addicts? The good folks lost big. The bad guys got away with blatent theft. This was an opportunity to impose some really big fines on some really big criminals and to take back the money that was stolen! But they got bailed out instead. Yay? Who says yay? This was an opportunity to set a precedent, to make a change.

If you don't stand up for yourself at some point, you will get trampled.
We are living proof of this, we are in fact, being trampled right now!.

We've got a media that is sold out, and unfortunately a government that seems to be sold out too! I mean really, why are the likes of Sarah Palin even in the news today? Why are Cheney's comments, like the ones he made today, even given any credibility? This is where the change needs to begin and until it begins we are stuck on the spinnings to nowhere.

Cheney should be arrested for his comments about Obama today. I feel it's truly traitorous to America to say what he has said.

Cheney and Bush should have been arrested a long time ago. We know this now for sure, the appointed committee to investigate 911 finally let what we all knew be known.
Why haven't they been arrested?
Why do they get away with it?
I'd like to know why, and don't tell me about turning the other cheek man, because it doesnt' cut it. As long as we let these kinds of crimes against our country, committed in our own country by our own citizens, go unaccounted for, there will be no change that is effective.

I'm frustrated, and angry about the way our current administration is not standing up to what has happened.

I'm tired of all the spin and farting. I'm offended at the power of celebrity in this country, it insults me. I'm tired of watching good people go down and excuses being made for creeps.
H

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Sting: Obama best person to handle world's 'mess'

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