Studio8 - Uniting the Arts

For years I have been puzzled as to why it is so important that we "grow" our economy. It is all about growth I hear, everyone wants growth.

Except this guy

http://interactive.nfb.ca/#/testtube

thx, JT, for this video. every thinking person should spend one minute seeing this (and more if they'd like to see the rest of the site!).

It is important that we grow our economy because we are so far in debt that the only way out is up. For instance, I have enormous credit card debt that I have been paying the minimum of, thus getting nowhere but behind. I can't save my way out of that debt. I have to find more income to pay it off. The government gets income from revenues that go up when the whole economy goes up.

Perhaps you are not so concerned about why this economy needs to be propelled upward as you are about the basis of the market system on greed?

Sorry I don't understand what that has to do with your credit card debt. Do you mean if the economy expands the government will have more money which will help you pay off your debt? Okay, then growth is good, I wish you well.

They tell me I used to be smart. But lately I am feeling pretty dumb. I just don't understand how growth can continue on and on when there are limited resources to go round. I really don't understand.

Cecil I am glad you liked the film. I discovered a treasure trove of excellent vidoeos on the National Film Board of Canada website.

http://www.nfb.ca/film/hofmanns_potion/

Not my credit card debt -- that was an example, an analogy for the national debt.

Growth does not have to be about using resources (especially about misusing resources). That has to do with the greed-based market -- owning all the toys to be on top. Growth of an economy means more trade. Trade these days is often knowledge-based. Or, it could mean clever ways of reusing resources.

More trade? More stuff? I still don't understand what you mean. How can you have more trade, make more stuff without using more resources?

Sorry I just don't understand.

Don't worry about it, I am confused. Don't let me confuse you too. Everything is going to be okay. Let's not worry about it, nothing lasts anyway.


http://www.guba.com/watch/3000028640

More trade without more "stuff" in the sense of physical objects. A great deal of trade these days is in intangibles. The major resource used is infinitely reusable -- thought, imagination, information

libramoon: "we are so far in debt that the only way out is up. For instance, I have enormous credit card debt that I have been paying the minimum of, thus getting nowhere but behind. I can't save my way out of that debt."

this is exactly the same position all but the 2%'ers are basically in. debt has become so large on a national level that realistically there is no way out of it despite what the 'experts' say. it's a perfect time to quit playing games with the futures of those whose income is far below the levels that the same 2%'ers are at.

Suzuki was speaking of this endless 'upwards movement' that cannot be sustained. so what do we *the collective we* do about the debt we are faced with? why not call in the debt worldwide, i.e. debt is erased from the books of all nations and all peoples beginning in 2011. who would get hurt by that? those that hold the debt and therefore hold those that have debt in perpetual hostage. screw 'em! let's start over with a clean slate. why continue paying for things and stuff that were purchased 5-10 years or longer that are quite possibly not worth a penny? it's all a huge and expensive joke that only the uber-wealthy understand. it's time we all look at debt, both our own and the country's and find out who we actually owe. we will find that every country in the world owes somebody and therefore their treasuries are bare... only beholding to bankers and corporate powers that call the shots ... all shots.

we cannot go any higher or any more in debt to get out of debt. the game is over and nobody will fess up to it... yet.

I been thinking maybe Obama might have to grow a mustache, maybe a soul patch too. That American Flag Pin he been wearing in his lapel don't seem to impress the republicans.
"Democrats are still living in a reality based community" A quote from a Bush political scumbag talking about the 2004 election.

Why are Rebublicans so much smarter than democrats.
Do you think they will go along with debt relief?

In the compromise on the tax cuts for the two percent and the middle class guess who wound up paying more taxes?

In fact, the only groups likely to face a tax increase are those near the bottom of the income scale -- individuals who make less than $20,000 and families with earnings below $40,000.
Huffington post

In the meantime what debt? Not all the citizens of the United States are in debt, our corporate citizens are doing quite well.

Corporate Profits Were the Highest on Record Last Quarter
''The nation’s workers may be struggling, but American companies just had their best quarter ever.
NYTIMESDOTCOM
Quote:

American businesses earned profits at an annual rate of $1.659 trillion in the third quarter, according to a Commerce Department report released Tuesday. That is the highest figure recorded since the government began keeping track over 60 years ago, at least in nominal or noninflation-adjusted terms.


http://www.bea.gov/newsreleases/nationa ... 10_2nd.pdf

Not all the citizens of the United States are in debt, our corporate citizens are doing quite well.

I think, if we must give "tax relief" to the wealthy it ought to come as US Government Bonds. We are so concerned with our debt to China and other not so friendly nations. Why isn't the US debt in the hands of US citizens who have a stake in what happens to this country?

JT: "In the meantime what debt? Not all the citizens of the United States are in debt, our corporate citizens are doing quite well."

From what I've heard corporate america has bought the votes to exclude themselves (the mega-corporations) from paying their fair share of taxes. as far as the corporate leadership, they also have bought themselves out of paying taxes. it pays to be ultra-wealthy, i reckon, judging by the non-partisanship between the 98%'ers and the remaining 2%'ers.

I know in my heart that Obama is a good man, but he is not the astute politician I had hoped for. Where the hell is a Harry S Truman, Teddy Roosevelt or FDR when we need one.
Who will stand up for the american people against the robber barons.

Why isn't the US debt in the hands of US citizens who have a stake in what happens to this country?

I don't know why.. Maybe because the Chinese are smarter than us?

I hope someone here can answer your question. I would like to know too. .