How Important Is Poetry?

[Lightning Rod]

http://drudgereport.com/flash3cp.htm

It is difficult
to get the news from poems
yet men die miserably every day
for lack
of what is found there.
~ William Carlos Williams, Journey to Love (1955)

[Lightning Rod]

The poem, to me (until I go broke) is an attempt, an experiment, a failing experiment, toward assertion with broken means but an assertion, always, of a new and total culture, the lifting of an environment to expression. Thus it is social, the poem is a social instrument.
~ William Carlos Williams

[Lightning Rod]

The poem, to me (until I go broke) is an attempt, an experiment, a failing experiment, toward assertion with broken means but an assertion, always, of a new and total culture, the lifting of an environment to expression. Thus it is social, the poem is a social instrument.
~ William Carlos Williams

By our own spirits are we deified:
We Poets in our youth begin in gladness;
But thereof come in the end despondency and madness.
~ William Wordsworth

Poetry is the breath and finer spirit of all knowledge; it is the impassioned expression which is in the countenance of all Science.
~ William Wordsworth

Poets, like friends to whom you are in debt, you hate.
~ William Wycherley

Even when the poet seems most himself . . . he is never the bundle of accident and incoherence that sits down to breakfast; he has been reborn as an idea, something intended, complete.
~ William Butler Yeats

I think it better that at times like these
We poets keep our mouths shut, for in truth
We have no gift to set a statesman right;
He's had enough of meddling who can please
A young girl in the indolence of her youth
Or an old man upon a winter's night.
~ William Butler Yeats, On being asked for a War Poem (1919)

The poet's eye, in a fine frenzy rolling,
Doth glance from heaven to earth, from earth to heaven;
And, as imagination bodies forth
The forms of things unknown, the poet's pen
Turns them to shapes, and gives to airy nothing
A local habitation and a name.
~ William Shakespeare, A Midsummer Night's Dream

To me it seems that one of the most important requisites for a great poet is a luminous style. The elements of poetry lie in natural objects, in the vicissitudes of human life, in the emotions of the human heart, and the relations of man to man.
~ William Cullen Bryant

[Dave The Dov]

When power leads man towards arrogance, poetry reminds him of his limitations. When power narrows the areas of manÂ’s concern, poetry reminds him of the richness and diversity of his existence. When power corrupts, poetry cleanses. For art establishes the basic human truth which must serve as the touchstone of our judgment.

- John F. Kennedy
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[abcrystcats]

Hey, surprise, it's me ... back for a test run. Presumably all the forces of evil have been purged from the website.

*****

As for poetry, I regret to say that I am questioning the value of art -- and poetry especially -- more and more every day.

I studied it, I wrote it, I "get" it, but for what? Every now and then a poetic voice speaks to me, it communicates something to me of a world I didn't know. But for what? Poetry doesn't change anything. It doesn't create anything. It doesn't rid the world of any evil. I suppose Dave is right in some of his quote:

"poetry reminds him of his limitations ... poetry reminds him of the richness and diversity of his existence"

This is all true, but once you've been reminded, what then? Poetry isn't an end in itself. It serves for some temporary amusement, inspiration or diversification of thought. Why make it a focus of your life, of your work, of existence? Why keep seeking after the beauty in life, when life isn't beautiful at all? Isn't focusing on poetry sort of a denial? Turn your back on everything in the real world and concentrate on the beauty of words, as used to describe the realities of human existence. With words, you are at least one step removed from any human existence.

Someone set me straight. My cynicism about all this has taken me over.

I think of the best poems I know, and all they do is express some truth that I have already experienced in some way. What is more real, the experience or the words? It's got to be the experience. ou could write a million poems about the sinking of the Titanic, but what would ever get you to the actual experience?


Poetry is just a record -- and a record that is inferior to painting, inferior to photography, inferior to video, and inferior to being there. Why do we continue to impose our impressions of life on life itself? Poetry is just another example of our ability to place a spin on the truth.

Sorry for the negative, but that is just how I feel about this subject right now.

[Zlatko Waterman]

Stay, Cat.

Nice to "see" you.

An old "professor",



Z

[Doreen Peri]

This is all true, but once you've been reminded, what then? Poetry isn't an end in itself. It serves for some temporary amusement, inspiration or diversification of thought. Why make it a focus of your life, of your work, of existence? Why keep seeking after the beauty in life, when life isn't beautiful at all? Isn't focusing on poetry sort of a denial? Turn your back on everything in the real world and concentrate on the beauty of words, as used to describe the realities of human existence. With words, you are at least one step removed from any human existence.

Hi Cat! Great to see you again!

I love your post, especially the questions you posed which I've quoted, because these questions question the validity of poetry and give me the opportunity to speak about what poetry is to me.

To me, seeking after beauty is only a minor part of writing and reading poetry. It's way more than that.

No! I seek an exploration of existence and being with the art of poetry. I want to see through other people's eyes and witness what they've seen. I want to touch their world with my fingers! I want to mix up the senses so someone can hear through my lips and touch through my tongue and taste through my imagination and observation.

Poetry works on levels which are much deeper than seeking out beauty. Because of the levels of metaphor and the skills in the craft of making words into music, poetry speaks to various dimensions of not only existence, but searching for a place, a place where you find someone actually identifies with what you are portraying in a word painting. A place where you come to a universal connection with another human being, whether he or she is the poet who is writing to you now, this moment, on the internet, or hundreds of years ago.

The craft of poetry is defined by definite skills. Those who can perfect the skills or, better said, use the skills to move the reader into an entirely different plane of awareness, are those who are the true Poets.

Is it about seeking beauty? Ignoring the pains and anguishes of life? Turning your back on everything in the real world?

Hell NO! Not at all!

Poetry can create escape, sure, or humor, or a seeking after beauty and peace which is hard to find in every day existence, and all that is fine, but let's go farther. I enjoy connecting with poetry that delves in the seedier sides of life.... in anguish and death and struggle..... in the human condition which we all share.

Why did a trusted companion leave? How did the death of a blade of grass in winter remind us of the death of our dear Aunt Lydia or our own mortality? What are the connections between how we hate rising in the morning to greet a day in the city streets watching prostitutes sell their loins for a shot of heroin with the pleasure we get by coming into contact with the lady on the corner who sells peonies and daffodils from her street stand? What is the connection between being dead to dreaming and being inspired to continue? What IS it that we, as humans, ALL have in common?

Poetry spells out human awareness in letters. And there are only 26 of them in the English language, so being that English is my birth language, this is the poetry I am aware of. Twenty-six letters. Hundreds of thousands of possibilities for musical sounds and words which connect us to a higher plane of discovery.

That's what poetry is about for me. It's about becoming everyone else.

It's about sharing my spirit until someone says, "YES! I know this feeling! I understand this image! " It's about me being able to crawl into the head and heart of another human being and reside there, momentarily, to know that the ugly they live and the beauty they seek, are similar to my own. It makes me feel one with the poet I am reading. And I hope I can make even one person feel one with me when he or she reads my words and how I've strung them together in an attempt to connect with the universe.

[Lightning Rod]

cat,

You don't know how I've missed your witty cynicism around here.
You inhabiit lands from which I'm banished.

Yes, poetry is useless. After all, it's my trade. Just entertainment.

[sooZen]

Cat...so nice to 'see' you and your question'ing' mind again.

I appreciate your sentiments and can see the validity but the bottom line in poetry and poeting is that those that do, cannot help it for them, it must be. We write poetry because we have to, it is a constant stream of consciousness that pours onto paper. Whether or not the output is benign, blase', insignificant or just plain tacky does not matter to the true poet.

A world without poetry...without Rumi or Neruda, I can hardly imagine. Songs are poetry and the words take us on a journey. A world without song...without Sting or Leonard Cohen, is not for me. Hah!

Peace,
SooZen

[lescaret]

Poetry is just a record -- and a record that is inferior to painting, inferior to photography, inferior to video, and inferior to being there. Why do we continue to impose our impressions of life on life itself? Poetry is just another example of our ability to place a spin on the truth.

Ouch, what a crash of angsty declaratives! A comparison (as in poetry is "inferior to painting") beggars variables. That is, against what qualities or criteria is the comparison made?

Ach, spit that intellectual seed into the black plum ocean.

No need to sink poetry's boat to drift the sea on a painter's raft (much less a video contraption).

One does the art one does, or doesn't do art at all. And a world without art would be a drearier place indeed.

"Well, while I'm here I'll
do the work -
and what's the Work?
To ease the pain of living.
Everything else, drunken
dumbshow."
- Allen Ginsberg
from "Memory Gardens", 1969

And guess what? Sometimes that work is poetry and sometimes it works.

[mtmynd]

poetry is a sailor with his nose deeply inhaling the sea air
...in hopes of getting a wiff of solid earth to plant his feet in
...in hopes of the scent of snatch of a 5 dollar wharf whore
...in hopes of smelling the uncorking of a new bottle or rum

these things are the pleasures sought
thru the voyage that burns in the heart
upon the ship that sails the endless seas
of loneliness and forlorn, carving dreams
into the bones of ancient mariners before

cecil

[abcrystcats]

Thanks for all the replies and kind thoughts. I didn't know I was missed!

OK, granted, Doreen, that poetry isn't just about beauty. That was a careless generalization of mine and you got me. It's about communication, "the human condition which we all share." It's about getting into the "head and heart" of another human being.

It's also about, as you said, using 26 letters in a variety of combinations which, in spite of their versatility, are admittedly still finite. Language has its problems and I often wonder if human beings were more skilled at communicating their feelings and intentions before language was invented.

I guess I just have to go back to the original question which was "HOW Important is Poetry?" How important compared to what? Compared to rescuing a person from a burning building? Compared to global warming? Compared to publishing a report on global warming? Compared to eating your breakfast or petting your dog? I still feel that even the simplest acts of life have possibly more relevance and/or "importance" than the best poem ever written. The best poetry, as you've described it, is an expression of life and feelings, so life and feelings take precedence, in my mind, to the poem itself.

Buddhabitch:

the bottom line in poetry and poeting is that those that do, cannot help it for them, it must be. We write poetry because we have to, it is a constant stream of consciousness that pours onto paper.

Yeah, ouch. Too true. I know you didn't intend it this way, but what you said was a direct hit. You could have just said: Those who can, do; those who can't ... gripe about it. It would have been just as near to the mark, LOL!

Seriously, I cannot imagine a world without poetry either, and I wasn't trying to suggest that we ought to all just forget about it and quit bothering. You are quite right that poetry is a compulsion of sorts for those that write it. Besides, I love to read it and I am consumed with envy when I read the poetry of a LIVING person who can really write!

But poetry STILL doesn't change anything. It doesn't rid the world of any evil. The question is still "HOW important is poetry?" and I wasn't trying to discount it but merely to compare it to other things. What is more real, the experience or the words? I would still say it is the EXPERIENCE, not the words, no matter how powerful or moving.

[sooZen]

Yes of course you were missed! Do not underestimate your contribution to the lively debate here. All are part of what make up the whole of this literary or artistic journey.

Those words, those 26 letters that Doreen referred to have just as much power to change things as any other work of art whether it be in song, fiction, or poetry. Why do you think the former and remaining communist countries incarcerate(d) artists, including poets? Writing poetry can incite all kinds of trouble...like freedom of thought.

I am one that thinks 'comparison' is a act of futility, for how does one compare a blade of grass to a pine tree...both are just as necessary. We may 'think' one is more important than the other but that is just our wanting to compare them.

Poetry may not be a superhero, ridding the world of evil, or rescuing damsels in burning buildings but no one can experience all that there is to experience in life. So if you cannot EXPERIENCE everything...how do you know how it feels? Poetry. Like a painting or a picture...words can take you to the experience and even you, dear Cat, will never be able to do all there is in this ole' world.

Peace,
SooZen

[Zlatko Waterman]

One of the difficulties in seeing poetry's possibilities in the US is our consumer-capitalist, money-oriented society.

In other countries, where poetry fulfills a political function ( Russia) or is fully integrated into spiritual beliefs ( Japan) or carries a long tradition of song (Spain) or becomes a mysterious bride to the unknown, the beyond ( Latin America)-- not implying that I have encapsulated the "sole" purpose of poetry in any nation or culture-- in other countries, I say, poetry isn't so much an ornament as a form of nourishment, accepted by the culture as a whole.

Bly once wrote, in some of his "crunk" polemics of the sixties and seventies, that "to be an American poet is to be thought of immediately as a bum."

Saint Francis was a bum also. His means of sustenance involved begging for the attention of others in public.

Whether the utterances of poetry "change" anything is debatable. Most diplomacy comes at gunpoint, to paraphrase Napoleon.

But as Stanley Kunitz said:

"Poetry is an emergency. It's a desperate need to say how things are. A need that never goes away."

Or, as LR said, "an assertion."

No one may notice, but hanging your poem on a plum tree branch like Basho did may change society, even nature, in a quiet way. No gunpowder explodes, no bullets rip into flesh. But something is altered, even if it's only the angle from which you see Mount Fuji through the mist the next time you encounter it.


--Z

[Dave The Dov]

Even in the smallest of change will yeid the largest result.
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