Good Gaza!

[tonyc]

tonyc,

I forgot to welcome you to S8

It's always good to have a unique voice in the mix

Whatever happened to LU?

Lu is still around..dead as hell though.
I forgot about this place, was trolling the net and found it in my favorites, thought I'd stop by and fan the coals.
Keep up the good work!!!

[one of those jerks]

I just thought of a better plan

Instead of moving the Jews to Wyoming or Alaska let's move the Palestinians to Alaska or Wyoming.

[mtmynd]

Relocate the Palestinians to Alaska. They'd be under the governorship of Sarah Palin.

<center>Palin for Palestine</center>
Catchy... but would it sell?

[one of those jerks]

<center>"Palin for Palestine"</center>

Would it sell?

You betcha.

It would make a great bumper sticker should she choose to run on Clay's absurdist party ticket.

[Nazz]

I just thought of a better plan

Instead of moving the Jews to Wyoming or Alaska let's move the Palestinians to Alaska or Wyoming.

Ok Jack, now it's my turn to get slightly annoyed here.

First off, Palestine is sacred land for both Jews and Muslims-- a religious reality. Yes I know-- I actually agree with your outlook that the whole planet is sacred, but for many wrapped so tightly in their doctrines (we're talking perhaps billions of people here), Palestine is sacred, holy ground.

Secondly, the Palestinians were there first, at least in modern times. So hypothetically or otherwise, if anyone is to move, why should it be the Palestinians?

And who is this Tony C loudspeaker with his FOX News spew? Rest easy Tony, The Terrorists are are getting cluster-bombed. God is great!!! And bloody!!!

Christ.

[one of those jerks]

Clay wrote:

The Poet's Eye has observed in the past that a simpler solution to the Israel/Palestine problem would be to give Wyoming to the Israelis and transport them all there in a modern airborne Exodus. They would have mobetta land and we would lose a headache.

This whole thread offensive to me mnaz. One out of every three jews in the world murdered in the twentieth century. And Clay writes a clever column about the Jews should be relocated to Wyoming.

Like I said elsewhere. Too late for Wyoming, The time for Wyoming come and gone. It would have been a great idea in 1940. I am sure the Jews would have jumped at the chance.

Yeah I am annoyed too

But what ya going to do.

You annoyed at me for turning Clay's post on its head. I got to love that.
Maybe I should have used a winkie. Sorry

Have you ever wondered where all those Palestinians in Gaza come from?

I heard they were displaced from some of those same Israeli towns that are the targets of the quassams. Who knows, I just read that somewhere.






Sorry I used to the word bullshit before.

I admire your rationalism

[Nazz]

Alright, I'm sure the whole idea of moving one side or the other to Wyoming or some place is all mostly said in jest, so I'm not sure why I'd take offense either way-- probably not worth my level of protest in the last post. Maybe after all is said and done most people conclude that there "was no choice" about sustained retaliatory bombing of residential Gaza, but I'm damned tired of one-sided government propaganda-- from any government, including my own and its "allies".

[one of those jerks]

On another thread about a Corsco poem you wrote

History is a pimp.

No more great men to make history

No Bismarks or Disraelis

No Alexanders or Julius Ceasers, no Charlegmanges or Napoleans,

Just politicians. Like George W. Bush, Harry Reid, and Ariel Sharon

So many missed opportunities for peace, so much arrogance...and ignorance.

And shallowness.

I have read that Israel thought they could play Hamas against Fatah back in the eighties. They encouraged Hamas in the begining. Just something I read. Here are my current bookmarks on Gaza, I have been following the war closely but I am losing interests. I have not been reading much about it lately. I think I will obsess on Darfur for a while.



http://www.geocities.com/silentwoman67/gaza.htm

[Nazz]

Well Jack, as I understand it, Israel purchased some of Palestine but took a lot of the land by force prior to statehood. As you pointed out, international ("Western" in particular) support for a Jewish state in Palestine dates back well before WW2, and conditions for Jewish refugees were so dire post-WW2 that perhaps a certain amount of aggression on the part of "Zionists" was justified. You opened my eyes to those realities. And here's another reality: to say that Islamic resistance is mystifying in its origin and has occured "in a vaccuum", is not intellectually honest or objective. Nothing of the sort ever happens "in a vaccuum".

On the other hand, it seems Hamas' dogmatic insistence on exclusive religious entitlement to the land is off-base as well. The Jewish people (and Christians) have ancient roots and religious tradition in Palestine as well as Muslims.

Yes, it does seem that Hamas is principally at fault in continuing to provoke deadly conflict, yet Hamas always claims it is in response to the abuses and arrogance of the Israeli government. And you're right, I also read that the Israeli government at first propped up Hamas-- I think it was mainly as a way to keep the PLO in check. Reminds me of when Wash. DC propped up all those nefarious jihadists (such as Osama) in Afghanistan to check the Soviets.

Frankly I'm not sure what to make of the never-ending mess. The Hamas charter has ominous rhetoric on waging holy war against the "Zionist invaders", and delivering the land back into Islamic control, supposedly per the Koran, but I'm not sure if this means literally the complete destruction of Israel, as the Israeli government and so many Western talking heads lead us to believe. Mixed in with such troubling rhetoric, you can also find passages in Hamas' charter, such as Article Six, that seem to speak of "coexistence" as a possibility.

I don't know, Jack. It's just one big headache and heartache. Much is made of Hamas starting shit and derailing/ignoring the Oslo negotiations in the '90s, but wasn't that also the time when the Israeli government was most aggressively pushing the settlements on disputed occupied land? I wish I knew the answer. Perhaps there simply is no good answer as far out as any of us can see. Perhaps there's nothing any of us can do about Palestine, and we'd better start working much harder on tragedies such as Darfur. Shit, what the hell do I know?

[one of those jerks]

I see this as a European war. I can see a straight line of causal events dating back to the Franco Prussian war of 1870.

<center>
Sometimes I think

Those that remember the past are doomed to repeat it.

I hate this feeling
Of knowing
of thinking that I know
anything.

sayonara

[Nazz]

Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat its mistakes.
Those who know history are doomed to repeat its mistakes too.

Perhaps forgetting is preferable to remembering.

I will not speak any further on this issue, at least for now, because it always gets me in trouble. It always pisses off someone or causes them to ridicule my efforts or basically dismiss them out of hand, and I don't need that in my life. I don't mean anyone in particular, just a general pattern it seems. And maybe I need a long break from this place anyway. Yes, sayonara.

[one of those jerks]

"the two minute hate"

we have pictures of men in ski masks
wooly faced immans

and I see nice clean cut upstanding white men
in nice suits
and good ties
and clean underwear

Jews and Christians
maybe black men too
without a clue

what makes me so smart

please don't take it personal Mark
I am one of those jerks

I can't get these fucking red shoes off my finger tips

I am almost out of here in more ways than one

I don't understand why you even have anything to say to me

don't go

at least don't go because of anything I wrote

I am one of those jerks you know.

[mtmynd]

not only does this latest Israeli/Palestinian debacle get great press in the U.S. media, but it also is the cause of many words and emotions on this site. it must really be something. is armageddon that near that nobody wants to miss the show?

i often wonder if china, japan, india and the whole pacific rim pays as much attention to the mid-east conflicts as we do? or is it a judeo/xtian/islam thing? what dominates their news media?

just thinking out loud.

[tonyc]

Nazz

And who is this Tony C loudspeaker with his FOX News spew? Rest easy Tony, The Terrorists are are getting cluster-bombed.

Uh hum, squeeze me, but I'm hardly a neocon or fox news viewer, where did you get that?
As far as our sensitive Hamas terrorist buddies who've been lobbing 90 missiles a day at Israel for the past eight years, I hardly feel sad that they're finally getting a taste of their own medicine.
Strange, but I've seen absolutley no posts complaining about the bombing of Israeli civilians over the past eight years, it's like business as usual.
So, let me get this straight.
A- Israel should just lay back and eat 90 missiles a day and do nothing.
B-It's cool for Hamas to use the Palestinians as human sheilds and Gaza as a launching pad for homemade missiles.
Stupid me, I'm sooooo narrowed minded at times, my bad.
Oh yeah, I forgot..
God Is Greatest!!!

[stilltrucking]

War is over for me Cecil.

I probably should have said that to mnaz

When I said sayonora I think I meant to this topic.


Those poor wretched people in Gaza. I wish we could at least move the children to a safe location the way the English did during the London Blitz.

I am sure this is getting a lot of press in Muslim countries everywhere Cecil.

By the way Cec,
I got some good news today
The war is over.
It is VE day, VJ day
johnny comes marching home day
Mission accomplished day
The world is safe for democracy day
Jubilation T Cornpone Day.
peace


tony c wrote.

God Is Greatest!!!

Yes
I like the way you giggle when you say that.