Studio8 - Uniting the Arts

Last November 15th, the Sunday Stream, Task Master, had a quote by D.T. Suzuki which included: "Human Beings talk - this is their will," which I initially considered to be a short-sided view towards people. After all when we look around at our numerous accomplishments, our good deeds, our efforts to aid each other and teach each other those things we ourselves have learned... even the arts we have created which speak their own language and provoke talk, and all D.T. can say is "Human Beings talk"? It seemed to be a slight miscalculation reducing all that we think we are, all that we have done, all that we've learned... and simply say "human beings talk"?

But since 'hearing' those three words they have echoed in my own head at least once a day, particularly when I observe others in daily life. Whether they're sitting in cars, buses, public places, even their work environment, there is that constant buzz of chatter that surrounds us. Alone in our cars, there is the likelihood of at least a radio playing music, listening to the news, hearing the advertisements pushing products or even those who speak to themselves or sing in the comfort of their own space. Words are a dime a dozen, or really much, much cheaper than that.

But not only are our words cheap due to the ability of each of us to make use of words, but words are also very valuable. We put value on certain words we hear from others, including the written word, to be confirmations of honesty, their own honesty to speak the truth. These valuable words are guarantees, treaties, business contracts... anything that places a value on promises to be kept.

We are so accustomed to our words.. our incessant talking, that we have learned to distinguish fact from fiction (most are anyway, depending upon who is saying what). Libraries are filled to capacity with words (which speak to the reader). We even have huge depositories dedicated to words (I'm thinking the Library of Congress in the U.S.). Words that have been saved from decades and even hundreds of years passed... they are still very important to us as hu'mans... it's a record of what we do: talk.

We pay our hard-earned money to hear others talk, be it newscasts, comedy, fact or fiction... as long as we can hear others we are in familiar territory. Without talk, we talk to ourselves... maybe not aloud, maybe out loud, but talk is our Nature. It's what drives us more that thinking... this ability to use our voices to make sounds that make sense to us.. we use that ability constantly... even when it makes little sense, we talk, talk, talk.

"Work is the curse of the drinking classes" is a quote from Oscar Wilde, a person well-known for his words. This particular quote, which not only favors drink, but to me epitomizes talk, for where else is talk so bountiful but amongst drinkers? Is it not an environment conducive to talk where one is more inclined to have a drink? In a climate such as an Irish Pub, sipping on a pint of Guiness or a shot of Bushmill's, chatting with one's friends, the idea of 'work' is a damnation... a curse word which has the tendency to destroy a good conversation. To imagine oneself leaving such a comfortable environment where talk is positive and even funny is such a departure from work where seriousness is key and talk is not encouraged for that is not what the employer is paying the person to do.

How many times have I been in that place where drinks are as plentiful as talk, where joy is heard in the same air filled with the sound of talk? Indeed, D.T. Suzuki, "Hu'man Beings Talk!" It is our will to do so and there is not a hu'man amongst us who is immune to saying what is on their minds to anyone who will listen.


cecil
07 march 2010

Picture of the Week:

good observations as usual, cecil. some among us are fortunate to to enjoy our work as well as our "free time," (not me, necessarily) but even the best day at work can't beat an evening of laughing and storytelling over some suds. that wilde quote is one of my favorites.

d.t. suzuki turned up in my thomas merton book. i'd like to read some more of his stuff some day.

The Wilde quote, when I came across it, gave me some pause... including a flashback of you and I on the deck with that bottle of tequila. My old heart prohibits such excessive activities any more, but memories haven't faded.

D.T. Suzuki has several books out on Zen. If interested, give Amazon a check.

Thanks for stopping in, Mark. I appreciate it.

our word for pub is bar!!

gracias for the stream, Cecil & the great photos!

saludos,

Arcadia

Thanks for the stream and the pictures Cecil.

I used to talk so much on CB radios for the first million miles. Then I got weary of the hate and discontent that was so constant. But some times in the wee hours out in the middle of that big empty space between Toyah and the I-10/20 split I would get lonely sometimes for the sound of another voice someone to listen to.

These text box rambles are like me holding a CB mike, instead of a keyboard.

I liked this cartoon a collaboration between Doreen and her sister.

Hola, 'V', amiga mia!

'Bar' is 'bar' here, tambien. 'Bar' is Spanish for 'bar'?

(btw: 'pub' is short for the word 'public' which is more of 'public place')

I wonder if Ireland is the only country that call a bar a 'pub'?


G'day, JT...

Cold and windy here since yesterday afternoon. Temp in the mid 50's but it's that wind that drops in down. That wind will be whipping thru the midwest in a few days, I reckon.

E-boards are silent talk in cyber-time, wouldn't you say? We're still talking but thru this medium which will one day change over to real speak. Not a great thing, I don't believe. Using this form of communicating provides a record of what is being 'said' where 'real speak' goes off into the ethers as soon as it's spoken.

Excellent comic strip... so true, eh?

But you're right, e-boards have changed the way we talk, or at least broadened the capacity to include the cyber-waves. If it wasn't for 'talk' the use for an internet would be drastically reduced if not eliminated completely.

Thx for the kind reply, old timer.

A good post, Cecil!
D.T. Suzuki makes an excellent three word point. Which makes me wonder at how constant the shouted refrain, from our grade school teachers,’ to: “BE QUIET!” No other student activity comes close in its censure than students talking. If only the teachers had read D.T. Think of all the futile “STOP TALKING!” talk that would have saved in class time. Think of all the time I would have been able to stay in class, rather than being sent to stand out in the hall, or sit in the principal’s office – for the unforgivable sin of talking.

For your follow-up topic, you might want to consider whether, for all that talk, if much of it is ever really understood.
”It is a luxury to be understood.” (Emerson)

It’s true that computers do have us talking more to each other, but do they aid communications?

”’Out of sight, out of mind,’ when translated into Russian (by computer), then back again into English, became, ‘Invisible maniac’.” (Arthur Calder-Marshall)

Really neat fences.

Howdy, NS!

Indeed, quieting the early chatter of children is not so much to squelch their desire to learn as it is to give an experienced voice the attention to teach learning. Your own shame you still carry with you like a deep scar as if it were teacher's fault and not your own chatter to blame.

NS: For your follow-up topic, you might want to consider whether, for all that talk, if much of it is ever really understood.

"Much" would be a luxury. Being a talker myself, I find that understanding is not the point of talking but rather the quiet contemplation within the aftermath of what was said is when understanding becomes questionable.

NS: It’s true that computers do have us talking more to each other, but do they aid communications?

I would have to answer that in the affirmative since any device such as the telegraph, telephone, radio and television all have aided the dissemination of communications exponentially. Whether any of these devices have truly 'aided' is arguable if communications is seen exclusively as an exchange of words to benefit both parties. What aids one will hurt another.

Howdy do to you too, MT !
M(ust)T(alk): Indeed, quieting the early chatter of children is not so much to squelch their desire to learn as it is to give an experienced voice the attention to teach learning.

NS: Who gets to decide what is “chatter,” and what is “experienced voice”? I’m living proof that most of my grade school teachers were imbeciles.

M(alicious)T(eachers): Your own shame you still carry with you like a deep scar as if it were teacher's fault and not your own chatter to blame.

NS: Yes, the yardstick has left permanent “scars” across my backside. The main message being, ‘a healthy respect for authority and its power to punish.’ Is that what you really want experience to teach your child? There is a world of difference between preaching and teaching. Yes, “humans talk.” They also have a large capacity to ‘learn.’ Should it be a surprise to hear that humans learn best by talking to each other? A good teacher engages their student’s interest in a topic by talking WITH them, not AT them.

MT: Being a talker myself, I find that understanding is not the point of talking but rather the quiet contemplation within the aftermath of what was said is when understanding becomes questionable.

NS paraphrasing: ‘Understanding is not the point of talking,’ but after a lag in time, given some time to digest quietly, Then understanding becomes the point of talking. Is that what you are saying? I’m trying to ‘understand’ you, and not just brush off your response as mere meaningless “talk.” Is that a mistake I am making?

MT: What aids one will hurt another.

NS: I don’t see how anyone is aided or hurt by communication, if, as you say, that ‘understanding is not the point’? Communicate to me in Spanish, as our friend Arcadia has done, and I can guarantee you that, say what you will, I will not be hurt, nor aided, in the least.

”What this country needs is more free speech worth listening to.” (Hansell B. Duckett)

NS (Noisy Silence)

NS: Who gets to decide what is “chatter,” and what is “experienced voice”? I’m living proof that most of my grade school teachers were imbeciles.

Certainly you don't expect that decision to be made by children, do ye? These young ones have been on this plane of existence but only for a fraction of their teacher. Who knows better?

Regarding you as living proof only tells me you are a rebel and if memory serves me "you're a rebel and you'll never be any good." [The Crystals]

Personally, I find the collective chatter of immature voices to be an irritant.

NS: Is that what you really want experience to teach your child? There is a world of difference between preaching and teaching.

I'd be content to know my children learned that there are many different voices of opinion in the world that they will too soon grow up and become a part of.

Now teaching is usually reserved for school while preaching is found in my words (:)) and if one is so inclined, within the walls of a church... so yes, I agree the two are different.

NS: Should it be a surprise to hear that humans learn best by talking to each other?

Your comment surprises me! I've found we hu'mans learn quite well by talking with each other, rather than to each other. The more intimate and personal a talk is, the more meaningful the conversation becomes and that tends to stick with the conversants far longer than not.

RE: MT: Being a talker myself, I find that understanding is not the point of talking but rather the quiet contemplation within the aftermath of what was said is when understanding becomes questionable.

What's not to understand here, N(o)S(avvy)? What's the point of my writing this (talking) and your not understanding?

Allow me to elaborate: When one is engaged in dialogue with another or more, the discussion is one of immediacy, i.e. response to another's words, be they a question or comment, is a response that is not mulled over to assure the responder that what is/will be said is understood, but the responder responds first and then may or may not question whether the respondent understood what was said. This is when the respondent's body language may come into play... what you said causes a curl of the brow, for example, which would indicate: "I don't understand what you're saying..".

Re: ”What this country needs is more free speech worth listening to.” (Hansell B. Duckett)

Did you not begin your last reply with: "Who gets to decide what is 'chatter,' and what is 'experienced voice'"? Do you think your old friend, Hansell, should be asked this same question with a slight alteration in wording, i.e. "What this country needs is more 'experienced voices' worth listening to."?

btw: ty for the comment regarding the 'art fences'. glad you enjoyed.

Human Beings talk and even some of them listen.

I have trouble talking, not responding, I can respond okay, but this talking gig, where you say your piece and others listen, that can be a trip. A blushing stuttering trip. It is nice to talk when one knows the other is listening, really listening, that is one of my favorite things to be a part of, and one which it has been my experience is rare. Though it could be the fault of this speaker! har har Never rule that out I mustn't.

Well, I came, I read, I talked a while, without too much of a stammer stutter, and now I return the stage to the better orators. *bows out smiling* Enjoyable as always, mt.

i always enjoy hearing what you have to say, even if you whisper it softly in your little mouse voice, it still resounds with kindness and humor. nothing cheesey about you, mouseyone, no siree!

thank you!

Hi
MT: Certainly you don't expect that decision to be made by children, do ye?

NS: Beings how education’s bottom line comes down to ‘learning,’ rather than teaching, listening rather than speaking, Yes, it is always the students that make the decision.

No one comes a complete tabla rosa. We each have our intrinsic nature which requires that a teacher ‘learn’ exactly what that individual’s nature is, and then to work ‘with’ it in order to aid in its development. Anyone working with animals, or plants, even with lifeless inanimate objects (e.g. wood, stone), comes to realize that they cannot impose upon the subject, but rather co-operate with it.

MT: Regarding you as living proof only tells me you are a rebel and if memory serves me "you're a rebel and you'll never be any good." [The Crystals]

NS: Well, the Crystals seemed to figure me out well enough. Unfortunately, the teachers were less able. Surely, this world has a place for rebels. Better educators could have/should have tried to make me the best damn rebel since Johnny Yuma.

MT: I'd be content to know my children learned that there are many different voices of opinion in the world that they will too soon grow up and become a part of.

NS: Yes, an important lessen, that. Yet, it can be learned best after one has come to understand their own voice.

MT: Your comment surprises me! I've found we hu'mans learn quite well by talking with each other, rather than to each other.

NS: You bring the more appropriate pronoun to my statement and thesis, thanks. But in doing so, you appear to have changed sides in our discussion(?).

MT: What's not to understand here, N(o)S(avvy)?

NS: I still do not get your convoluted statement’s purport, try as I may.

MT: "What this country needs is more 'experienced voices' worth listening to."?

NS: No, I don’t believe ole Hansell (nor Grettle) intended that at all. What he is illustrating (IMO) is that “worth” is a subjective value judgment. One which every individual student applies each moment to their teacher.
NS (Needs Studying)