Ulterior Decoration

[e_dog]

I have cut the Freudian slip-knot.


* * *


Anything that leads me from my mind
is a welcome distraction.


* * *


The bartender miscategorized
my "profit center," aptly, as "dinner."



* * *


a chaos of nuances



* * *


You correct the grammar
of my death sentence.

[e_dog]

this is reposted from the Creative Writing boards, where it got no hits.

it is obviously not a polished or even completed thing, just some fragments. but i wanna test whether they at all resonate.

[Doreen Peri]

OK, e-dog. First off, sorry I missed this the first go 'round on the CW board. Why? 'Cause I like it!

So, here's my interpretation.

What I like about it is that it takes me into your head. It's disconnected, but not. You've got some very effective lines in here.

Also, the brief lines, which jump from one thought to the next ... it's almost like being in my own head when I'm trying to figure something out. So, this piece, to me, represents following disconnected thought processess, attempting to create a unity, trying to determine something. Working something out in your head and now, in mine.

"Freudian slip-knot" - is a great image. It slides, it's sexual, and now it's sliced! What does that mean? To me it's like you have severed something symbolic to you. Something meaningful. You've cut it off.

Then, right after that, you jar me because you've pulled me into your head, yet you claim you want to get out of it. And I agree, anything that leads me from my mind to a larger place is quite welcome, indeed.

The next line about the bartender, well, it's humorous and almost nonsensical. But that's why it's humorous. Why would a bartender be categorizing anything as a profit center? You throw the reader's head into a new place! I like that. Dinner? I love having dinner at the bar.

Ahh.... then comes "a chaos of nuances" which is actually an apt description of my entire life!

The last lines are the type of lines which I try to write. It's a pun but layered with meaning. It makes me wonder who the "you" is. Is it someone you love? Someone who troubles you? Someone who teaches you? We all have a death sentence. Each and every one of us. So, this can speak to all .... but what is it saying? I don't know but I love it because of the play on words and how sharply it ends your piece.

All in all, this piece worked for me as a piece that made my mind jar and think off-kilter. It made me feel like I got into your head while you were really in mine.

[Trevor]

Hi E-dog,

As a whole poem, it didn't click with me. The format was fine - though jarring, and appropriate for what I interpreted the central theme to be, which was all lines circled around the idea of the first line. I guess I didn't feel that there was enough conflict or contridiction for what I thought this poem was about. Plus I do have a certain negative predisposition to writing that has a stream of consciousness feel to it. I'm not saying it doesn't have its place in writing, its just not on my bookshelf. But nonetheless, sometimes some very interesting fragments come from this style.

"I have cut the Freudian slip-knot. "

I actually love the first line. Says a lot to me. A slip-knot, being easily untied, is cut instead of loosened for the freedom. What would Freud say about that? Also liking Freudian philosophy to a slip knot is good description...then again, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.

"Anything that leads me from my mind
is a welcome distraction."

Which is an impossibility, almost like saying I've escaped the constraints of my mind by thinking of something else. This line was okay, interesting but didn't really stick with me.

"The bartender miscategorized
my "profit center," aptly, as "dinner."

Now my jury is still deliberating on this part. Kind of gives me a feeling of abstract contridiction...miscategorized - aptly, bartender - dinner..but all of it set in abstraction due to the phrase "profit center". I think I would like disliking it, but a part of me really enjoys reading it over and over. I would enjoy to know the meaning and intent of this section.

"a chaos of nuances "

This is where it went flat for me. Seemed more like an effort to be clever but for me it never reaches anywhere past that.

"You correct the grammar
of my death sentence."

Interesting statement that I'm interpretting as where life's values are placed, even in the fleeting moments of life. Again, didn't really stick with me.

I prefer more structured work, so take what I've said with that in mind. Personally the poem as a whole doesn't do much for me because there is no meat on the skeleton. Though I did find some of it interesting. I would like to see some of it developed, such as the first, third and last parts of this work. And when I say developed I don't necessarily mean in a structured way, I think stream of consciousness or abstract, does work but only if there are more ideas floating along side a semi-central theme or thought.

Thanks,

Trev

[e_dog]

this is very interesting, already your responses are totally unexpected in parts, and helpful. thanks.

i won't comment on the rest of the lines, which are supposed to be kind of food for thought, but i will clarify the one line which seemed the most puzzling yet is really the only direct observation in the piece: the "profit center" and "dinner" words are direct quotes from a receipt from a bar, which has on its automated computer system a clasification of the patrons' "profit center" printed on the bill, in my case it said "dinner" although the speaker was only there for a drink at the bar. i assume they classified the different areas of the establishment (e.g. bar, dining, special events). that's all.

[Trevor]

Hi edog,

"i won't comment on the rest of the lines, which are supposed to be kind of food for thought"

And why not? It won't change what I got out of this piece by rather enhance it. I'm not looking for validation for my opinions from the author but rather a different, more objective perspective. However, if you are holding back in leui (sp?) of more response so as not to objectify the work, then I totally understand...but don't play the pretentious artiste....lol..jk, notice the extra e, wish they had accents here.


"the "profit center" and "dinner" words are direct quotes from a receipt from a bar, which has on its automated computer system a clasification of the patrons' "profit center" printed on the bill, in my case it said "dinner" although the speaker was only there for a drink at the bar. i assume they classified the different areas of the establishment (e.g. bar, dining, special events). that's all."

See to me, that's a greeeat concept and a great situation that unintentionally lends itself to a social commentary poem or prose etc. And that's what i'd love to see developed. The story is so rich when you explain it but rather flat and abstract when you simply state the punchline to the audience. I appreciate you giving the reader credit, but if you constantly expect a guessing game, then it will either come across as a constant guessing game or prentention.

Anyways, thanks for taking the time to clarify the profit center lines, take care,

Trev

[Trevor]

Hi Edog,

Just re-read what I had written....hope it doesn't come across as harsh especially the pretention part...wasn't trying to say you were being pretentious, in fact the completely wrong choice of word. I know you weren't trying to be that and honestly it doesn't come across as pretention...so my apologies for a poor choice of words.

[e_dog]

actually, i would like to try to be pretentious. that would be quite a satirical, or parodic, feat.

[Trevor]

"actually, i would like to try to be pretentious. that would be quite a satirical, or parodic, feat."

Okay, now you really are starting to sound pretentious..lol jk

[e_dog]

i don't wanna sound pretentious, nor rude, but i am not sure you have a very firm grasp on the precise meaning or sense of the word "pretentious."

[Trevor]

Well edog, I'd use the dictionary as a reference but I know how much you hate such things, so ala Trev's recipe for prentention...one part - false heirs, one part - superiourity complex...perhaps a tsp of condescention and one healthy dash of bullshit....Is that good enough for you? Did I pass Edogs literacy test? lol

"actually, i would like to try to be pretentious. that would be quite a satirical, or parodic, feat."

...now I interpreted that as you saying that a guy like you couldn't possibly be pretentious...and by the word choice (satirical and parodic) it was like..."its laughable to even think that I man like me could be pretentious"....which might be interpreted as a pretentious statement if said in the right tone...you know, smoking jacket, pipe, sitting with a warm glass of port and faux laugh as you spoke.... and though I know it wasn't meant like that, I thought I'd be a wise ass and jokingly play it up as if it was.

But all this doesn't make a donkey's balls lick of difference because I had already corrected my original use of pretention and admited that it was a poor word choice...and the last comment i was just joking around, albiet lame humor...now I'm not trying to be rude either...but my advice is to loosen the tie man and crack a sud or pour a stiff gin...and don't worry too much about my use of pretention

[e_dog]

well, i know you didn't mean it this way but "pretentious" can be an insult.

but,

as i understand it sans dictionaire is that someone is pretending to be something they are not, such as pretending to be noble or pretending to be intelligent or successful or artistic or 'in the know', etc. etc. now, i may be full of shit, but i am not pretending to be: i really am full of shit!

[Trevor]

"well, i know you didn't mean it this way but "pretentious" can be an insult."

For sure, and that's why I was so quick to correct myself, because I realized it was a totally poor choice of words, so if you were insulted by my original comment, then please accept my apology. What I was trying to convey initially, was that to not allow the reader into the meaning of work, if there is an intentional meaning or theme etc. can sometimes come across as being unnecessarily mysterious or elusive without cause...or something along that lines....to be honest I'm kinda stuck on how to convey the thought, though in all honesty none of it is meant harshly.

"as i understand it sans dictionaire is that someone is pretending to be something they are not, such as pretending to be noble or pretending to be intelligent or successful or artistic or 'in the know', etc."

Yes I agree that falls into pretention...hence my explanation using false heirs.

Here's the Mirriam Webster definition for whatever that is worth:

characterized by pretension : as a : making usually unjustified or excessive claims (as of value or standing) <the pretentious fraud who assumes a love of culture that is alien to him -- Richard Watts> b : expressive of affected, unwarranted, or exaggerated importance, worth, or stature <pretentious language> <pretentious houses>


"now, i may be full of shit, but i am not pretending to be: i really am full of shit!"

LOL...nice line ...well how can I argue with that, you'll never hear me imply you are pretentious ever again...lol

Again, my apologies for the word mix up earlier.

[stilltrucking]

You correct the grammar
of my death sentence.

I'll take a stab at that.

norman mailer looks for the courage of a psycopathick killer
And I make so many grammatical mistakes that I have to grab hold of my seat cushion with both cheeks because I get so puckered up.

[stilltrucking]

As if I could do the grammar.

Oh Ludvig Baby let's do lunch sometime.

Studying the grammar of the expression "expression of meaning" will teach you something about the grammar of the word "meaning" and will cure you of the temptation to look about you for some object which you might call "the meaning".