The Creationist Museum in Louisville, KY

[mtmynd]

This is taken from an article I read today -

Despite the showmanship behind the $27 million museum opening here Monday, the evangelists who put it together contend that none of the gleaming exhibits are allegorical. God did create the universe in six days, they say, and the Earth is about 6,000 years old.

and another -

Polls suggest that about half of Americans agree. They dismiss the scientific theory that all beings have a common ancestor, believing instead that God created humans in one glorious stroke. Similar numbers of people say the world's age should be counted in the thousands of years, not billions, as established science would have it.

This amused/amazed me -

Charles Leckie, a family doctor in Tupelo, Miss., wrapped a family vacation around a visit. On the way, they stopped at Mammoth Cave National Park in Kentucky, where Leckie challenged the guide's assertion that the rock formations are millions of years old. He asks why people should believe "so-called experts." After all, "they're all human."

"They're all human..!?!? So are you, Dr. Leckie... a doctor I assume that would consider yourself an expert at your field of choice, or are you only a "so-called expert" ? Very strange...

Is this an explosion in ignorance going on in the U.S.? Really. I seriously doubt that there is any other country in the world that has this undying faith in Christianity to the point that there could come a time when Jesus will become President. This country is in serious trouble with these fundamentalist infiltrating our political system as it is doing. Graduates from the evangelical colleges have jobs working in Congress and the Executive Branch.

For the complete article -
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 00908.html

Is there anyone out here that buys into this? I would like to hear from you and discuss this.

The first thing I'd ask you is, "If you do not believe in evolution why would you ask people to believe in creationism. Is this not substituting one belief for another... a belief in the words of the Bible that is exactly what the extremist Muslims do - belief in the words of the Koran without question."

[stilltrucking]

Mtmynd asked:

Is this an explosion in ignorance going on in the U.S.?

What would you expect from a country that was settled by the the wretched refuse of teeming shores?

ref·use 2(rfys)
n.
Items or material discarded or rejected as useless or worthless; trash or rubbish.

Sorry Cecil. I am always bummed out on Memorial Day.
Going to be a long weekend. Old and young battle scared men in tears, and patriotic draft dodger's with american flag lapel pins giving speeches about those who made the ultimate sacrifice.

I wonder how old surfer mike is doing these days?
I hope he has a good day, jimbo and you too.

P.S.
The earth was created on October 23, 4004 B.C. I think that was a Thursday.

http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/project ... ssher.html

[mtmynd]

truck: "Sorry Cecil. I am always bummed out on Memorial Day."

sounds like a pattern you've developed over the years... a sort of self-indoctrination.

i'm a verteran, too, but that was then and this is now. fortunate enough to have been in the navy aboard an air craft carrier (cva-43) that helped bomb the cong, but having learned the foolishness of a war based upon the base line of greed (oil fields in the gulf of tonkin). while veterans possibly should not be forgotten, 'tis better to understand the facts behind every war that makes veterans.

good day to you, soldier!

[Arcadia]

each time I have to teach that in seventh grade I ask for their ideas: "from monkeys!", "an also the bible says...". Half of my students are catholics (the church near the school is Nuestra Señora de la Salud...), the other half Testigos de Jehová, Baptists and from other Pentecostal churches. Before reading the social sciencies text books I offer them to read cosmogonic myths. This year we read a tehuelche one (where a lonely crying god created the world in a week from his tears), a buddist one about a crashing egg, a chinese one about old men with different colors that ruled and created different elements (they talked also about a japanese cartoon with similar caracteristics), then the mayan myth... they couldn´t avoid to say.... wow!! it´s similar to the bible so..?!! laughs and big eyes for a little moment.

[Arcadia]

I know Harold Bloom wrote about the U.S.A-christian-way some years ago, I don´t know the name of the book, I read an article about it somewhere.

[Lightning Rod]

Arcadia,

You are a wise teacher indeed

give them comparisons
let them decide
teach them that the world is bigger than their backyard

You have the most important job in the world

[e_dog]

US is a nation founded by religious fanatics. and pseudo-rationalists.

In God We Trust. Who else you gonna trust?

Not Bush/Cheney. Then necessarily, God!

[Scootertrash]

This is taken from an article I read today -

Polls suggest that about half of Americans agree. They dismiss the scientific theory that all beings have a common ancestor, believing instead that God created humans in one glorious stroke. Similar numbers of people say the world's age should be counted in the thousands of years, not billions, as established science would have it.

Honestly, does anyone really think half of our countrymen are so superstitious and ignorant to actually believe that? If so, we are a lot worse off than I thought...

i'm a veteran, too, but that was then and this is now.

Good afternoon to you and the Missus, Cecil....hope all is well with you and your family this holiday weekend.

[Arcadia]

nice calco!!!

thanks for your kind appreciations l-rod!. To teach is for me the greatest job (except for the money) and at the same (sometimes) the more alienating and esquizofrenic one, but I like it!!

I have to go to the supermarket now (I hate that but I don´t have nothing in the fridge since last friday!)

[mnaz]

Well, according to the devout LDS couple I stayed with in Utah, the following things are absolute truth:

1) The 9/11 attacks were God's direct punishment for things like MTV and general all-round wickedness.

2) The earth is 13,000 years old.

3) God has hurled large objects at the earth when angry with His creation-- objects large enough to shift the planet's axis of spin.

4) "Celestial marriage" (formerly defined specifically as polygamy by J. Smith-- until that tenet interfered with Utah's chance at statehood) is a requirement for admission into heaven, or at least for a better seat in heaven.

5) By following the letter of doctrine in every way (and making sure to get married), one may actually become God and obtain their very own galaxy to rule over!

There's more, but you get the idea... not making any of that up... enough to make some of the mainstream "evangelical" talking points seem a bit tame by comparison... (well, except for that whole Antichrist/Last Days business) And this guy in Utah is an accomplished (retired) systems engineer.

I grew up with that Armageddon/2nd Coming stuff continually drilled and drummed into my head in a sprawling Sunday School compound out in the suburbs, and I'm only now starting to realize the mighty grip that that system has on our national psyche. "Evangelism" was supposed to mean "sharing the gospel and letting others decide for themselves", I thought, and not this pervasive, institutional suburban "God mafia" that's developed.

Anyway.... you know, there are actually (at least) two creation stories in Genesis.... The six-day "glorious stroke" account, versus the Adam/Eve in the Garden tale. So to "dismiss the theory that all (human) beings have a common ancestor" amounts to dismissing the whole Eden thing, eh? What would God say about that?

[Lightning Rod]

You mean I'm the only draft dodger here?

[stilltrucking]

Well Clay do you wear an American flag lapel pin and give speeches on memorial day.?

I think those people who went to canada or went to prision rather than get inducted have nothing to be ashamed of.
Me myelf I felt guilty for years because of my 4f status. When the Gulf of Tonkin incident did not happen I tried to enlist. I tried to tell them I wasn't really crazy, I wanted to do my patriotic chore. Because I was born to follow.

Cecil when I said I was sorry, I meant I was sorry I got off topic. I only mentioned the Memorial day because you were wondering what kind of country we are.

I am first generation American Cecil. My family were among those wretched refuse fortunate to find refuge here. And I am maybe the only person here who is not a baby boomer. Not counting the young ones here. I was born before the war. My earliest memories are of the war.

Hell yes I am indoctrinated. I tried to inlist in August of 1964 but they would not take me just because I could not fall asleep at night without the comforting thought of a shotgun perched under my chin.

yeah
I me me mine
more about me
yes indeed

Jack Kerouac
Angel Headed Hipster
'The only meaning the world has for me,' he once observed in his notebook,'is how it unfolds to me.'

Angel Jack

shitx
shitz
I am rambling

Back on topic, I would like to have a nickel for everytime I have heard some creationist preacher quote Einstein on God not playing dice with the universe. Einstein's god was spiinoza's god.

(When Einstein was asked if he believed in God, he said, "I believe in Spinoza's God.")

Spinoza's mighty Nature may have been God enough for Einstein, but it was not enough for Leibniz, and it doesn't satisfy the proponents of intelligent design or those who put service to God above service to man. Stewart recognizes the problem. Spinoza's God, he acknowledges, "will make no exception to its natural laws on your account; it will work no miracles for you; it will tender no affection, show no sign of concern about your well-being; in short, it will give you nothing that you do not already have."

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/02/26/books ... yt&emc=rss

Speaking of surfermike.

I remember surfermike writing about the time he saw God in VIetnam. When last seen god was wearing aviator sun glasses, and flying a helicopter. It saved mike's life that day. And that is proof enough for me.
Because I am blessed in believing what I have not seen.

[Lightning Rod]

yeah, I UNlisted

I went into the draftboard with paisley pants
eating a bunch of white wine grapes
a ring in my ear
told em I was queer

didn't have to go to Canada
they knew I would be more trouble than I was worth
in their Man's Army

Arlo Guthrie woulda been proud

[mousey1]

Well I'm a religious girl who sins on a whim. What ya gonna do, what ya gonna do. But...

let me start again.

I'm religious. Believe in God and the whole creationism thing. Believe the Adam and Eve razzmatazz with some provisos. Like, I don't really know how it goes, but it seems to me God is the creator of we human beings. As far as dinosaurs, well I don't know who created them, but I've seen their bones so know they did exist. My God does not have to be responsible for the creation of everything everywhere, only of we earthlings so...

so we've got to keep an open mind. Going by a few Bible hints it appears there are such things as angels, cherubim and seraphim, other Godly cohorts, ghosts and after-life's and before-life's. There is nothing new, no nothing, so it appears our 'spirit' if you will, originated somewhere else before popping into my and everyone else's individual skins.

We are creatures of light given a chance to live mortally. I do believe there are good and bad spirits and if you're a bad spirit well you'll probably go back from whence you came and if you're a good spirit, well again, back to where you came from. As far as sin, well I think the concept of such is perhaps more intended as initial guidelines for sensibly navigating without getting sucked into potentially harmful things. Typical human behavior seems to be to grab any and all wisdom and then twist it into some unrecognizable thing. I don't know.

I stop short of calling it or us one of God's little experiments...more so a chance to experience. For let us be real here, life really is pretty amazing, a blessing. Of course there is the whole devil thing...

you know, Lucifer and all his minions. Angel gone bad or some such thing.

It all sounds far out and spacey indeed, but yet not so really, if you really think about it. It's sort of like the existence of life on another planet or realm only in this case consisting of superior beings of which God is the head, the top king pin.

Of course I could be on crack and whistling through my ass again.

My modus has always been a sort of a wait and see thing. We shall have all the answers nicely laid out in a row one day, one, perhaps not so far off, day.

And so there you have my beliefs in a bit of a nut shell.

Anyway to respond to your queries here, specifically this one

Quote:
Polls suggest that about half of Americans agree. They dismiss the scientific theory that all beings have a common ancestor, believing instead that God created humans in one glorious stroke. Similar numbers of people say the world's age should be counted in the thousands of years, not billions, as established science would have it.

Could it be that the earth due to a destructive asteroid or whatever the scientists believe caused the demise of the dinosaur et al, had made the world void of life, the atmosphere shot and that God, who himself refers to himself as a we when he said "Let us create man in our image, after our likeness", came upon the scene and created the earth that we are familiar now with seeing and inhabited it with mankind? Remember how in the early years of the Adam and Eve saga how it mentions that the angels did find some of the humans attractive and did mate with some of the prettier ones thus resulting in giants? You know, this is all quite intriguing. And clearly I am rambling all over the place a little helter skelterly, but you do see my drift...yes?

Alot of Christians are very strict and staunch in their beliefs, their superiorities, but really much of the basics of what they've twisted things into are more far-fetched than what the true scenario probably consisted of.

Have I made any sense at all?

Specific questions anyone?

I know alot of people like to point fingers at God for being a cruel shit disturber, but there are many forces at work, not least of which is this pesky free will and choices choices choices that come into play. And there really do seem to be evil forces at work that defy explaining. I think we've all felt them haven't we, though have attempted to explain them away?

Of course all my arguments are completely moot if you don't give a hoot about anything the Bible has to say. If you're a tried and true doubting Thomas of anything spiritual and not touchable by your own pinkies, you'll pooh-pooh everything I have just tried to say.

I guess I tend to believe in a bit of a mix of creationism and evolution. That makes sense to me. All things evolve, even God I imagine.

Okay, you can all point and laugh at me now.

Though it makes more sense to me than thinking all life evolved from an amoeba crawling up outta the muck. Maybe dinosaurs originated by crawling up outta the muck billions of years ago, but I doubt that I, or even you for that matter, did.

disclaimer: Nothing I believe is actually chiseled in the stone of my brain. I am constantly reassessing.

And what do you believe?

[e_dog]

God didn't create man. The Devil did. Then he created God to fool us.

Then we killed them all, but not yet ourselves.